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Ossatron failure

Posted by michael s on 1/25/00 at 00:00 (015107)

While I'm most probably going to give it one more go - whenever I can get an appointment my doctor will show up for - my first try with the Ossatron shockwave procedure was a total failure. After waiting more than the requisite twelve weeks for results, there's just no real improvement. I have the same severe morning stiffness, the same type of pain thru the day, and the same severity of pain.
Before anyone doubtful or critical of the shockwave idea, or the Healthtronics people and their American study, stands up and cheers, I do want to say that this is incredibly frustrating for me. I've been a little suspicious of some of the stuff posted around here by Ossatron supporters, but I forked out the big bucks and gave it a try. I had to - I've had pf for twelve years, tried everything, done surgery twice, and this thing continues to wreck my life. Or mess it up pretty terribly, anyway. I was certainly hoping that shockwaves might help.
As I've posted before, the doctor who performed the procedure felt I was an especially tough case. He's a surgeon, and the fact surgery hadn't previously helped, plus the fact that I'm diabetic, made him feel that the odds were against me. BUT the other doctor who performs the procedure here in Toronto wasn't at all fazed by my medical history -and is quite puzzled right now that I haven't had at least some success. As well I didn't put much stock in the comment about my diabetes being a problem, since too many doctors have a rather dated image of diabetics as frail and unhealthy individuals. (Though, to be fair, the surgeon's comment that diabetics often seem to suffer from thick muscle tissue and constant joint problems might be true.)
Meanwhile, I'm not overly thrilled with the Institute of Sports Medicine, for what that may be worth for anyone heading this way. Too many delays, missing X-Rays,confusing instructions, conflicting forecasts,and doctors who don't want to drive in the snow to keep their appointments. Lots of staff and not enough genuine focus on the patient, it seems to me. And a suggestion that I'd get 80-90 percent improvement looking like a load of nonsense,at the moment.
Anyway, I'll see if another round of shockwaves does anything. In the meantime I won't be talking here much - as I haven't been lately - I'm just too unhappy right now. I'm going to have this pain forever, it seems.
Take care all.

Re: Ossatron failure

VickiJ on 1/26/00 at 00:00 (015116)

I'm so very sorry that the procedure did not work for you and especially that you have been suffering for so long and are so discouraged. This is going to sound so trite and such an understatement but IT IS SO UNFAIR that you and others have to suffer so much and get to little REAL HELP or relief.
HANG IN THERE. DO SOMETHING REALLY WONDERFUL FOR YOURSELF...A MASSAGE? A FABULOUS DINNER OUT? I hope with all my heart there is some light in your life very soon!

Re: Ossatron failure

alan k on 1/26/00 at 00:00 (015120)

A couple years ago your story would just pass by me without comment. At least now with my pain I can understand others, even though part of that understanding is knowing that I can't possibly truly understand.

There is something very lonely about pain. It's obvious to all of us what that is.

Have you looked into a neurologist for peripheral neuropathy? It causes footpain and is common complication of diabetes. You probably know all that already and I am a broken record on this board. Still, there has to be a way to figure out what's wrong with the long-term foot-painers.

take care,
alan k


Re: Ossatron failure

PHIL L on 1/26/00 at 00:00 (015134)

I am very sorry for your nagging foot problems, But not suprised
that OSSATRON did not work,if you look back at my post you will see where most of the paitents where bought and paid for,trips to the
Institute for sports profit and all treatments.

I have been dealing with this several years myself and spent thousands,even gave up couple of jobs do to foot problems.
we can transplant organs but can fix a damn foot,you tell me

all you have left is GOD take it day by day and again i am sorry
and very very well understand..


Re: Ossatron failure

Margie from Atlanta on 1/26/00 at 00:00 (015137)

Michael, Please see 'view guestbook' for my post on 1/22/00 and also the surgery guestbook 9/8/98. If you do you will see that I have felt much the way you sound. A year ago, just before I had the 2nd Ossotron treatment, I was ready to give up on everything. I can't say for sure whether it was the 2nd treatment or a combination of that and all the other things I was doing but over the past 10 years the ONLY thing I haven't tried is surgery. I know I will always have to deal with some sort of pf pain...but now it is such a small amount that I'm thrilled and I never thought I'd ever get to this point. So keep your chin up! Good luck. By the way, Dr. Cross in Atlanta (the doctor who did the Ossotron study I was in) told me that people like me who had had pf for so long might need 2 treatments to work and for me he was right.

Re: Ossatron failure

Scott R on 1/26/00 at 00:00 (015140)

Phil L, there is no indication from previous posts that more than 1 person has had the Ossatron treatment for free. By lying like this (either on purpose or by accident), your are committing libel. Is this the 2nd or 3rd time you've lied to people in the message board?

Re: Ossatron failure

Martha B. on 1/26/00 at 00:00 (015141)

Please please give it 1 more chance-especially since you live so close.The ossatron has been a blessing for me and I am so very sorry that it hasn't helped you thus far.I will repeat this ONE more time-I funded my total trip and treatment myself!!!!! All my postings have been MINE with no coercion from anyone.

Re: Ossatron failure

Duane E on 1/27/00 at 00:00 (015148)

Twelve weeks healing time for tissue of this type is a little fast. The typical wound healing model time-frame for surgical wounds is:

Inflammation: (0 to 5 days)
Proliferation: (day 2 to 25 days)
Neovascularization: (day 2 to 7 days)
Collagen Synthesis: (day 2 to 360+ days)
Maturation: (day 21 to 700+ days)

I continued to have improvement (that I could notice) past 16 weeks post ESWT. However that improvement continues to be very slow.

ESWT by definition is therapy; and taking therapy over a period of time is to be expected. Some people have received OssaTron treatments for tennis elbow three times before a satisfactory resolution was attained. Its possible that a recalcitrant case of plantar fasciitis may be more difficult to cure than a case of tennis elbow, due to the relatively higher intensity use the feet get compared to the arms.

You may have had more improvement than is apparent from your amount of pain relief. The portion of the fascia that is the main pain generator may still be choked in scar tissue. So, more ESWT is needed.

John Warlick mentioned on this site some weeks back, the issue of tissue necrosis as a possible reason for some ESWT failures. He said something to the effect, that some researchers believe using energy levels normally used to treat bones was a possible solution.

ESWT is a sound theory. It just takes time. So don't get discouraged, its still very early in the treatment cycle.

Re: Ossatron failure

john h on 1/27/00 at 00:00 (015156)

i have had at least 2 discussions with my doctor (orthopedic surgeon) about what is the pain generator in pf. he strongly says that science indicates it is the nerve (baxter nerve under the fascia) that is the primary culprit. this nerve runs under the fascia just forward of the inside of the heel where the band of fascia from the big toe attaches to the heel. dr. baxter the well respected surgeon from houston, tx who is referenced in the Wheeless Book of Orthopedic Surgery strongly suggest this. Obviously there can be other sources of pain from other problems. it is possible that over a long period of time a nerve can be chronically irritated to the point it will never be totally pain free. this does not mean it cannot be made better but instead of planning to run the boston marathon plan to walk 3 miles a day.

Re: Ossatron failure

VickiJ on 1/26/00 at 00:00 (015116)

I'm so very sorry that the procedure did not work for you and especially that you have been suffering for so long and are so discouraged. This is going to sound so trite and such an understatement but IT IS SO UNFAIR that you and others have to suffer so much and get to little REAL HELP or relief.
HANG IN THERE. DO SOMETHING REALLY WONDERFUL FOR YOURSELF...A MASSAGE? A FABULOUS DINNER OUT? I hope with all my heart there is some light in your life very soon!

Re: Ossatron failure

alan k on 1/26/00 at 00:00 (015120)

A couple years ago your story would just pass by me without comment. At least now with my pain I can understand others, even though part of that understanding is knowing that I can't possibly truly understand.

There is something very lonely about pain. It's obvious to all of us what that is.

Have you looked into a neurologist for peripheral neuropathy? It causes footpain and is common complication of diabetes. You probably know all that already and I am a broken record on this board. Still, there has to be a way to figure out what's wrong with the long-term foot-painers.

take care,
alan k


Re: Ossatron failure

PHIL L on 1/26/00 at 00:00 (015134)

I am very sorry for your nagging foot problems, But not suprised
that OSSATRON did not work,if you look back at my post you will see where most of the paitents where bought and paid for,trips to the
Institute for sports profit and all treatments.

I have been dealing with this several years myself and spent thousands,even gave up couple of jobs do to foot problems.
we can transplant organs but can fix a damn foot,you tell me

all you have left is GOD take it day by day and again i am sorry
and very very well understand..


Re: Ossatron failure

Margie from Atlanta on 1/26/00 at 00:00 (015137)

Michael, Please see 'view guestbook' for my post on 1/22/00 and also the surgery guestbook 9/8/98. If you do you will see that I have felt much the way you sound. A year ago, just before I had the 2nd Ossotron treatment, I was ready to give up on everything. I can't say for sure whether it was the 2nd treatment or a combination of that and all the other things I was doing but over the past 10 years the ONLY thing I haven't tried is surgery. I know I will always have to deal with some sort of pf pain...but now it is such a small amount that I'm thrilled and I never thought I'd ever get to this point. So keep your chin up! Good luck. By the way, Dr. Cross in Atlanta (the doctor who did the Ossotron study I was in) told me that people like me who had had pf for so long might need 2 treatments to work and for me he was right.

Re: Ossatron failure

Scott R on 1/26/00 at 00:00 (015140)

Phil L, there is no indication from previous posts that more than 1 person has had the Ossatron treatment for free. By lying like this (either on purpose or by accident), your are committing libel. Is this the 2nd or 3rd time you've lied to people in the message board?

Re: Ossatron failure

Martha B. on 1/26/00 at 00:00 (015141)

Please please give it 1 more chance-especially since you live so close.The ossatron has been a blessing for me and I am so very sorry that it hasn't helped you thus far.I will repeat this ONE more time-I funded my total trip and treatment myself!!!!! All my postings have been MINE with no coercion from anyone.

Re: Ossatron failure

Duane E on 1/27/00 at 00:00 (015148)

Twelve weeks healing time for tissue of this type is a little fast. The typical wound healing model time-frame for surgical wounds is:

Inflammation: (0 to 5 days)
Proliferation: (day 2 to 25 days)
Neovascularization: (day 2 to 7 days)
Collagen Synthesis: (day 2 to 360+ days)
Maturation: (day 21 to 700+ days)

I continued to have improvement (that I could notice) past 16 weeks post ESWT. However that improvement continues to be very slow.

ESWT by definition is therapy; and taking therapy over a period of time is to be expected. Some people have received OssaTron treatments for tennis elbow three times before a satisfactory resolution was attained. Its possible that a recalcitrant case of plantar fasciitis may be more difficult to cure than a case of tennis elbow, due to the relatively higher intensity use the feet get compared to the arms.

You may have had more improvement than is apparent from your amount of pain relief. The portion of the fascia that is the main pain generator may still be choked in scar tissue. So, more ESWT is needed.

John Warlick mentioned on this site some weeks back, the issue of tissue necrosis as a possible reason for some ESWT failures. He said something to the effect, that some researchers believe using energy levels normally used to treat bones was a possible solution.

ESWT is a sound theory. It just takes time. So don't get discouraged, its still very early in the treatment cycle.

Re: Ossatron failure

john h on 1/27/00 at 00:00 (015156)

i have had at least 2 discussions with my doctor (orthopedic surgeon) about what is the pain generator in pf. he strongly says that science indicates it is the nerve (baxter nerve under the fascia) that is the primary culprit. this nerve runs under the fascia just forward of the inside of the heel where the band of fascia from the big toe attaches to the heel. dr. baxter the well respected surgeon from houston, tx who is referenced in the Wheeless Book of Orthopedic Surgery strongly suggest this. Obviously there can be other sources of pain from other problems. it is possible that over a long period of time a nerve can be chronically irritated to the point it will never be totally pain free. this does not mean it cannot be made better but instead of planning to run the boston marathon plan to walk 3 miles a day.