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New Section for PF book

Posted by Scott R on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017623)

I'm considering adding a new paragraph to the main document. Your critical comments are welcomed and needed.

The Medicine Mind Game

The most prominent feature of 'art' is its ability to influence or manipulate the emotions, feelings, and thoughts of the audience. In my dictionary, 'physician' is an arcaic synonym for 'artist'. 'Artist' has in its definitions 'one who is adept at deception' and 'a skilled performer.' Today's medicine men still admit their profession is more art than science, but hopefully not as much as it was in the days of the original medicine men, shamans, and snake-oil salesmen. When a doctor walks into the room holding his next patient, a highly trained and experienced artisan is concentrating on a single member of the audience. Doctors are experienced with almost every thought, emotion, or situation patients can dream up. They have quick responses for every question or comment. They've seen it all, year-after-year, and have well-rehearsed lines for each possible scenario. If a patient deviates from the script and speaks too much, he is often treated like a heckler ruining the act and deftly swept aside. Do doctors wear lab coats because they are scientists or because they are actors acting like scientists? The question is 'Has the doctor you've chosen selected his lines based on what's best for the patient or what's most profitable for him?' The question cannot be answered by a single visit because the artisan is highly trained and gifted, knowing that appearing to care for the patient is an important element of profit. In an ideal world, the patient's health and the doctor's profit would go hand-in-hand. In such a world we could only hope that the doctor would manipulate us all the way back to good health. If you feel you are on confrontational terms with a doctor, it may be because you are trying to improve your health or save money while he is trying to improve his income or protect his ego (a big ego is a prerequisite for taking money from others while keeping a clear conscious).


Re: New Section for PF book

Scott R on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017624)

Is the new section just pointless, wasted words?

Re: New Section for PF book

John V on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017626)

I personally like the paragraph; it speaks the truth and may be helpful to those of us who have dealt with multiple docs in seeking some cure or relief. It's not going to change any doctor's approach but might let the patient know that the problem does lie with the patient. One suggestion: you probably mean 'conscience' in the last sentence, not 'conscious'.

Re: New Section for PF book

wendyn on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017627)

I can't argue with anything you've written...but you won't be scoring any points with doctors (not that you're out to score brownie points with them anyway).

The informed patient of today seems to be a huge frustration for doctors that are not accustomed to having to justify treatments or answer questions.



Re: New Section for PF book

john h on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017628)

probably as important as anything we do for our condition is to become well enformed and to understand that there are very good doctors and very bad doctors. how we separate them is indeed an art and not science. in medicine as in any endeavor 'let the buyer beware'! the recent article about the new york poditrist problems probably just touch the surface.

Re: New Section for PF book

john h on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017629)

i have talked to a number of doctors as probably many of you have who have never heard of EWST,Norland,Healthtronics,Orbasone,etc. You would think that specialist in this field would have the minimum heard of these companies,procedures,etc. it does not give you much confidence.

Re: New Section for PF book

BJC on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017630)

I don't like it! I never have thought of a dr. as deceptive, and if I felt that were the case I would, and have, left the dr. in a heartbeat. Over the years I have been treated by many caring, competent drs in all specialty areas. The best ones were those who considered me a partner in MY healthcare. They do exist! I have found that, almost without exception, that drs. who perceive you as informed and asking pertinent questions are those who are willing to go the extra mile. As a patient you also have certain responsibilites in the relationship as well. Being considerate of others is a two-way street. I'm not sure what that paragraph would accomplish, as it is quite inflammatory. I'm sorry your experiences make you feel this way.

Re: New Section for PF book

Kim B. on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017631)

Hi Scott,

I like the paragraph very much and identified with it, thinking, 'Thank goodness, I'm not the only one who has ever felt that way.' So, in that way I find value in it.

One more thought that comes to mind. The paragraph title is great too, but, maybe should you elaborate on the title and say something like 'The Medicine Mind Game - A Prospectus' or '... - One Man's Prospectus' or something of that nature, to indicate that what the writer has written is not scientific (more like art), and based on your personal experiences with both medicine and through managing this board. Prospectus may not be the right word. Maybe 'Perception' or 'Observation' would work. I think you get the idea.

Hope my input makes sense, and helps you decide exactly how you want to present this. It's a good piece and based on the sum of the replies you receive, may need no changes at all.

Regards, Kim B.



Re: New Section for PF book

VickiJ on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017633)

I haven't read your book for some time...to see what you may have addes since I first discovered it, but I remember it being mostly an objective statement of facts that allowed me to learn and apply what I could feel comfortable with. I have to say that your new section sounds more like a personal catharsis than an objective attempt to help people deal with the medical profession. It sounds very angry and bitter. Not objective or enlightening. And I'm afraid may turn some people off...not just doctors...who read your book for the first time.

I have had my share of bad doctors that you describe in your paragraph and so the temptation is to say 'Right on Scott!' But it would be very unfair to the really good ones I've worked with also. What I have learned is to remember that I am in control of my well being when I go into their offices...To take responsibility for my health and who I let help me with it. I have no insurance at the moment so it all comes out of my own pocket...which is far more liberating and empowering than I ever realized it could be...I am the one who will determine if I will work with them, it isn't just their decision and I interview them very intensely before I let them begin examining me...those whose ego gets in the way or rely on pat answers are immediately crossed off my list...but I let them know right up front what kind of doctor patient relationship I am looking for...an open one where they are willing to creatively problem solve with me...I make it really clear that I don't accept things on face value alone or the first prescriptions they come up with. I do this in as charming and humorous way I can and quite frankly since I have adopted this approach I never get the ego or slick answers I used to.

If you have yet to experience a good working relationship with a doctor, I suggest you think again before you write a review of the profession that will be read by desperate sufferers looking for answers or guidance. It may turn people away from seeking help when they should. My experience with the medical profession says some are exactly as you describe and many are good, caring people who are not.


Re: New Section for PF book

Beth D. on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017638)

Hi John H.,

I have spoken to my MD and podiatrist about it and they've never heard about it either. It's even on the AAOA website. A little disheartening when you think this is what the do for a living.

Beth D.


Re: New Section for PF book

Dr. Zuckerman on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017640)

I like the book section. From my side of the curtain, I like the patient to be involved in the care. I find the best patient is the one that knows why I am doing what I am doing. I want him to know what I can and cannot do. When I was first in practice I traveled around and saw alot of podiatrists that did alot of good and alot of bad. I learned from both. I saw doctors cut for money. The bottom line is that the only way a doctor is going to make money is to do the right thing and treat the patient like he would his family. I see many patients that would let me do any thing to them. The lack of education about heel spur pain is so bad out there that the public could be hurt or tricked . A good doctor in my mind is someone who knows what to do and is able to explain to the patients what they need not what the doctor needs. For example i just had two patient tonight that had heel pain for about two months. I could of talked them int EPWT or I could of talked them into surgery. The pain was that bad. I felt and still feel that a local steriod injection for acute pain could resolve the pain in these patients. They didn't have any previous treatment. They came to me for surgery. I explained to them that first of all that spur isn't sticking out the bottom of the foot. Did you know that alot of people think that the spur is sticking out the bottom of the foot and it must be cut out.

Anyway I think you get my point. Education Education Education !!


Re: New Section for PF book

Nicole V.R. on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017644)

When I asked my family doctor what he thought of my getting the ESWT he suggested I call the Philadelphia School of Podiatry, since they would be most up to date on these type things. I did, and they never heard of using the treatment for heelspurs, either! Amazing!
Scott, I don't quite know what to think of the new info. yet but I do like the new font for the message boards!

Re: New Section for PF book

WendyW on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017649)

I haven't written to this board in quite some time, but your paragraph above seems so unlike the impression I had gotten of you, I feel compelled to write. I have had some bad experiences with Doctors and some wonderful ones too. If I had read that paragraph on your home page, I would have left the site immediately and written it off as another place for people to gripe; and, consquently, never would have seen the good that comes from the participation and knowledge sharing that occurs here. I followed many of the suggestions I learned of here, including how to document your own story and take it to a doctor. I received a very good response from the Doc, not the scripted scenario you propose in your paragraph.

Cool off, Scott, from what ever is troubling you today. You have as much, if not more, right to vent here on the message board as anyone; but I would like to see you protect the value of your home page document.


Re: New Section for PF book

WendyW on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017650)

Nevermind, I see you already have put the message in the PF book. So much for feedback.

Re: New Section for PF book

Scott R on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017655)

Thanks very much to all for such excellent and quick feedback. I guess if I had felt good about the section I wouldn't have asked for a second opinion. I've decided to leave it out. I have been struggling about what to say about PF being a cash cow for the medical community for several years, so it isn't just a 'bad day' thing. By continuing to be silent on this I feel I am being dishonest, just as I feel doctors are being dishonest and even cruel when they give zero information on this subject when a patient first demonstrates the symptoms. They should give a handout explaining what needs to be done because once diagnosed, it requires knowledge more than doctor visits (for the conservative treatments). Instead they give shots, prescribe hardly useful pills, require that you buy $300-$400 orthotics that do more harm than good by being to high in the arch, and forget to mention stretching (but we can't blame them for that, stretching isn't profitable - what did we ever do for them?).

So I will stick to the 'party line': Go see your doctor. Trust your doctor. He isn't only after money. This is what I am saying if I say nothing. Sticking to tunes like this one that people already are familiar with is good art. It makes more money. It sells more books. It gets more links. The disagreeable stuff has no place in the book.

(yes I'm still angry about it, but not at anyone in particular, just the frustration of having to choose being nice over being honest. again. )


Re: New Section for PF book

VickiJ on 3/22/00 at 00:00 (017657)

Phew! THis is certainly a new side of yourself that you are sharing here Scott...

Does this 'cash cow' opinion toward doctors in general include the ones you met for the ESWT...is that why none of 'the gang' are answering my question regarding what the doctors advised you folks about cause and prevention? As skeptical as Iam and have been re ESWT, I was eagerly awaiting to see what happens with the people who had the treatment... to see if it was something that I would consider down the road if I don't ever heal completely...but man, after your tirade Iam assuming you are lumping them in with all the others whom you consider to be in it for the money and nothing else.


Re: New Section for PF book

Scott R on 3/22/00 at 00:00 (017659)

Dr Gordon was much nicer than any of the doctors I've seen in the U.S.

Re: New Section for PF book

VickiJ on 3/22/00 at 00:00 (017661)

Do you really have to chose 'being nice over being honest'? Do you really think it is impossible to tell the truth, that is: 'that it is very difficult to find a doctor that will be helpful, up front, honest, and actually problem solve with you, etc. etc. but some people on the board report they have...and here are some techniques for determining if a doctor is going to truly work to heal you...etc.' without condemning the entire profession?

So Dr. Gordon was 'much nicer'...was he any better at the things you are condemning US doctors for...educating patients about pf and how to facilitate healing and prevent further damage, proper footwear, what to tell your doctor at home, icing, stretching, walking?


Re: New Section for PF book-- don't completely give up

alan k on 3/22/00 at 00:00 (017666)

Scott,

I think you are right to not publish the statement as is, but I urge you not to give up on the idea.

As you know, my experiences match your paragraph completely. Even the one nice podiatrist I had was just doing it because he knew that's what patients want. He sold me $400 orthotics with super high (what's that stuff called at the bottom?) which gave me mild tts. No adjustments on my orthotics and he quickly referred me to someone else. And so on...

My expressions of doctor hate have dropped sharply lately, due to my successful home treatment.

I think you MUST say something, but be mild. Just say some doctors may act in manner a,b,c and some don't. The advice you might give might be a milder and more tentative version of the advice Robin B gave me some weeks back (if you can find it) about how to deal with doctors with your own selfish interest in mind, and not expect more from them than medicine dispensement. That advice fits my situation perfectly but not everyone's.

You DO need to caution people and give advice on how to negotiate medical treatment: that is as important as ANYTHING else on the website, so don't give up. Just be careful not to completely condemn something which after all we all depend on in some small way at least (I for instance find western medical anatomy helpful-- that's not saying much for medical professionals I know).

One small other point: comments about medicine men and shamans etc. while making for good rhetorical metaphors also might suggest broad based dismissal of approaches to healing from other cultures which are not based on western doctoring. That's just my little tic, but I feel those approaches shouldn't get wholesale short shrift anymore than western medicine should.

thanks for listening, and for providing the only thing that was useful,

alan k


Re: New Section for PF book--My own two cents worth

DannyT on 3/22/00 at 00:00 (017670)

What about a physician referal area where we could post information about the medical professionals that we have had positive experiences with? This could help point PF sufferers toward competent, knowledgeable doctors. Negative posts could be excluded/deleted to maitain the positive intonations of this web site. Just a thought.

Re: New Section for PF book

GinaC on 3/22/00 at 00:00 (017674)

As part of the group receiving free ossatron treatment in Toronto, I was not told anything about causes/prevention of PF. Then again, I was not scheduled for or paying for any type of consultation about this condition. I went there for a specific treatment which I was given by a very busy and well-intentioned doctor, who was upfront about the fact that some of us might not benefit from treatment. And, if there are treatment failures among the 'ossatron gang,' it certainly won't be the first time that has happened to any of us, so I was more than willing to take my chances.

Re: New Section for PF book

Bob G. on 3/23/00 at 00:00 (017715)

I think it fits, Scott; it is important to consider the good, bad, and the ugly amonst us. Some doctors could do us harm, most I believe won't - but, one must be proactive in distilling the difference. For example, if a taxi driver picks up passengers with little or no questions, he may not live to enjoy social security. A patient picks and chooses a physician, and a patient who blindly accepts this or that doctor without question reads his diagnosis in a fortune cookie. Personally, I want to live, so I size up people I deal with up front, including doctors. By the way, I was a cab driver and learned quickly to ask questions.

Re: New Section for PF book

Scott R on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017624)

Is the new section just pointless, wasted words?

Re: New Section for PF book

John V on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017626)

I personally like the paragraph; it speaks the truth and may be helpful to those of us who have dealt with multiple docs in seeking some cure or relief. It's not going to change any doctor's approach but might let the patient know that the problem does lie with the patient. One suggestion: you probably mean 'conscience' in the last sentence, not 'conscious'.

Re: New Section for PF book

wendyn on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017627)

I can't argue with anything you've written...but you won't be scoring any points with doctors (not that you're out to score brownie points with them anyway).

The informed patient of today seems to be a huge frustration for doctors that are not accustomed to having to justify treatments or answer questions.



Re: New Section for PF book

john h on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017628)

probably as important as anything we do for our condition is to become well enformed and to understand that there are very good doctors and very bad doctors. how we separate them is indeed an art and not science. in medicine as in any endeavor 'let the buyer beware'! the recent article about the new york poditrist problems probably just touch the surface.

Re: New Section for PF book

john h on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017629)

i have talked to a number of doctors as probably many of you have who have never heard of EWST,Norland,Healthtronics,Orbasone,etc. You would think that specialist in this field would have the minimum heard of these companies,procedures,etc. it does not give you much confidence.

Re: New Section for PF book

BJC on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017630)

I don't like it! I never have thought of a dr. as deceptive, and if I felt that were the case I would, and have, left the dr. in a heartbeat. Over the years I have been treated by many caring, competent drs in all specialty areas. The best ones were those who considered me a partner in MY healthcare. They do exist! I have found that, almost without exception, that drs. who perceive you as informed and asking pertinent questions are those who are willing to go the extra mile. As a patient you also have certain responsibilites in the relationship as well. Being considerate of others is a two-way street. I'm not sure what that paragraph would accomplish, as it is quite inflammatory. I'm sorry your experiences make you feel this way.

Re: New Section for PF book

Kim B. on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017631)

Hi Scott,

I like the paragraph very much and identified with it, thinking, 'Thank goodness, I'm not the only one who has ever felt that way.' So, in that way I find value in it.

One more thought that comes to mind. The paragraph title is great too, but, maybe should you elaborate on the title and say something like 'The Medicine Mind Game - A Prospectus' or '... - One Man's Prospectus' or something of that nature, to indicate that what the writer has written is not scientific (more like art), and based on your personal experiences with both medicine and through managing this board. Prospectus may not be the right word. Maybe 'Perception' or 'Observation' would work. I think you get the idea.

Hope my input makes sense, and helps you decide exactly how you want to present this. It's a good piece and based on the sum of the replies you receive, may need no changes at all.

Regards, Kim B.



Re: New Section for PF book

VickiJ on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017633)

I haven't read your book for some time...to see what you may have addes since I first discovered it, but I remember it being mostly an objective statement of facts that allowed me to learn and apply what I could feel comfortable with. I have to say that your new section sounds more like a personal catharsis than an objective attempt to help people deal with the medical profession. It sounds very angry and bitter. Not objective or enlightening. And I'm afraid may turn some people off...not just doctors...who read your book for the first time.

I have had my share of bad doctors that you describe in your paragraph and so the temptation is to say 'Right on Scott!' But it would be very unfair to the really good ones I've worked with also. What I have learned is to remember that I am in control of my well being when I go into their offices...To take responsibility for my health and who I let help me with it. I have no insurance at the moment so it all comes out of my own pocket...which is far more liberating and empowering than I ever realized it could be...I am the one who will determine if I will work with them, it isn't just their decision and I interview them very intensely before I let them begin examining me...those whose ego gets in the way or rely on pat answers are immediately crossed off my list...but I let them know right up front what kind of doctor patient relationship I am looking for...an open one where they are willing to creatively problem solve with me...I make it really clear that I don't accept things on face value alone or the first prescriptions they come up with. I do this in as charming and humorous way I can and quite frankly since I have adopted this approach I never get the ego or slick answers I used to.

If you have yet to experience a good working relationship with a doctor, I suggest you think again before you write a review of the profession that will be read by desperate sufferers looking for answers or guidance. It may turn people away from seeking help when they should. My experience with the medical profession says some are exactly as you describe and many are good, caring people who are not.


Re: New Section for PF book

Beth D. on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017638)

Hi John H.,

I have spoken to my MD and podiatrist about it and they've never heard about it either. It's even on the AAOA website. A little disheartening when you think this is what the do for a living.

Beth D.


Re: New Section for PF book

Dr. Zuckerman on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017640)

I like the book section. From my side of the curtain, I like the patient to be involved in the care. I find the best patient is the one that knows why I am doing what I am doing. I want him to know what I can and cannot do. When I was first in practice I traveled around and saw alot of podiatrists that did alot of good and alot of bad. I learned from both. I saw doctors cut for money. The bottom line is that the only way a doctor is going to make money is to do the right thing and treat the patient like he would his family. I see many patients that would let me do any thing to them. The lack of education about heel spur pain is so bad out there that the public could be hurt or tricked . A good doctor in my mind is someone who knows what to do and is able to explain to the patients what they need not what the doctor needs. For example i just had two patient tonight that had heel pain for about two months. I could of talked them int EPWT or I could of talked them into surgery. The pain was that bad. I felt and still feel that a local steriod injection for acute pain could resolve the pain in these patients. They didn't have any previous treatment. They came to me for surgery. I explained to them that first of all that spur isn't sticking out the bottom of the foot. Did you know that alot of people think that the spur is sticking out the bottom of the foot and it must be cut out.

Anyway I think you get my point. Education Education Education !!


Re: New Section for PF book

Nicole V.R. on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017644)

When I asked my family doctor what he thought of my getting the ESWT he suggested I call the Philadelphia School of Podiatry, since they would be most up to date on these type things. I did, and they never heard of using the treatment for heelspurs, either! Amazing!
Scott, I don't quite know what to think of the new info. yet but I do like the new font for the message boards!

Re: New Section for PF book

WendyW on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017649)

I haven't written to this board in quite some time, but your paragraph above seems so unlike the impression I had gotten of you, I feel compelled to write. I have had some bad experiences with Doctors and some wonderful ones too. If I had read that paragraph on your home page, I would have left the site immediately and written it off as another place for people to gripe; and, consquently, never would have seen the good that comes from the participation and knowledge sharing that occurs here. I followed many of the suggestions I learned of here, including how to document your own story and take it to a doctor. I received a very good response from the Doc, not the scripted scenario you propose in your paragraph.

Cool off, Scott, from what ever is troubling you today. You have as much, if not more, right to vent here on the message board as anyone; but I would like to see you protect the value of your home page document.


Re: New Section for PF book

WendyW on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017650)

Nevermind, I see you already have put the message in the PF book. So much for feedback.

Re: New Section for PF book

Scott R on 3/21/00 at 00:00 (017655)

Thanks very much to all for such excellent and quick feedback. I guess if I had felt good about the section I wouldn't have asked for a second opinion. I've decided to leave it out. I have been struggling about what to say about PF being a cash cow for the medical community for several years, so it isn't just a 'bad day' thing. By continuing to be silent on this I feel I am being dishonest, just as I feel doctors are being dishonest and even cruel when they give zero information on this subject when a patient first demonstrates the symptoms. They should give a handout explaining what needs to be done because once diagnosed, it requires knowledge more than doctor visits (for the conservative treatments). Instead they give shots, prescribe hardly useful pills, require that you buy $300-$400 orthotics that do more harm than good by being to high in the arch, and forget to mention stretching (but we can't blame them for that, stretching isn't profitable - what did we ever do for them?).

So I will stick to the 'party line': Go see your doctor. Trust your doctor. He isn't only after money. This is what I am saying if I say nothing. Sticking to tunes like this one that people already are familiar with is good art. It makes more money. It sells more books. It gets more links. The disagreeable stuff has no place in the book.

(yes I'm still angry about it, but not at anyone in particular, just the frustration of having to choose being nice over being honest. again. )


Re: New Section for PF book

VickiJ on 3/22/00 at 00:00 (017657)

Phew! THis is certainly a new side of yourself that you are sharing here Scott...

Does this 'cash cow' opinion toward doctors in general include the ones you met for the ESWT...is that why none of 'the gang' are answering my question regarding what the doctors advised you folks about cause and prevention? As skeptical as Iam and have been re ESWT, I was eagerly awaiting to see what happens with the people who had the treatment... to see if it was something that I would consider down the road if I don't ever heal completely...but man, after your tirade Iam assuming you are lumping them in with all the others whom you consider to be in it for the money and nothing else.


Re: New Section for PF book

Scott R on 3/22/00 at 00:00 (017659)

Dr Gordon was much nicer than any of the doctors I've seen in the U.S.

Re: New Section for PF book

VickiJ on 3/22/00 at 00:00 (017661)

Do you really have to chose 'being nice over being honest'? Do you really think it is impossible to tell the truth, that is: 'that it is very difficult to find a doctor that will be helpful, up front, honest, and actually problem solve with you, etc. etc. but some people on the board report they have...and here are some techniques for determining if a doctor is going to truly work to heal you...etc.' without condemning the entire profession?

So Dr. Gordon was 'much nicer'...was he any better at the things you are condemning US doctors for...educating patients about pf and how to facilitate healing and prevent further damage, proper footwear, what to tell your doctor at home, icing, stretching, walking?


Re: New Section for PF book-- don't completely give up

alan k on 3/22/00 at 00:00 (017666)

Scott,

I think you are right to not publish the statement as is, but I urge you not to give up on the idea.

As you know, my experiences match your paragraph completely. Even the one nice podiatrist I had was just doing it because he knew that's what patients want. He sold me $400 orthotics with super high (what's that stuff called at the bottom?) which gave me mild tts. No adjustments on my orthotics and he quickly referred me to someone else. And so on...

My expressions of doctor hate have dropped sharply lately, due to my successful home treatment.

I think you MUST say something, but be mild. Just say some doctors may act in manner a,b,c and some don't. The advice you might give might be a milder and more tentative version of the advice Robin B gave me some weeks back (if you can find it) about how to deal with doctors with your own selfish interest in mind, and not expect more from them than medicine dispensement. That advice fits my situation perfectly but not everyone's.

You DO need to caution people and give advice on how to negotiate medical treatment: that is as important as ANYTHING else on the website, so don't give up. Just be careful not to completely condemn something which after all we all depend on in some small way at least (I for instance find western medical anatomy helpful-- that's not saying much for medical professionals I know).

One small other point: comments about medicine men and shamans etc. while making for good rhetorical metaphors also might suggest broad based dismissal of approaches to healing from other cultures which are not based on western doctoring. That's just my little tic, but I feel those approaches shouldn't get wholesale short shrift anymore than western medicine should.

thanks for listening, and for providing the only thing that was useful,

alan k


Re: New Section for PF book--My own two cents worth

DannyT on 3/22/00 at 00:00 (017670)

What about a physician referal area where we could post information about the medical professionals that we have had positive experiences with? This could help point PF sufferers toward competent, knowledgeable doctors. Negative posts could be excluded/deleted to maitain the positive intonations of this web site. Just a thought.

Re: New Section for PF book

GinaC on 3/22/00 at 00:00 (017674)

As part of the group receiving free ossatron treatment in Toronto, I was not told anything about causes/prevention of PF. Then again, I was not scheduled for or paying for any type of consultation about this condition. I went there for a specific treatment which I was given by a very busy and well-intentioned doctor, who was upfront about the fact that some of us might not benefit from treatment. And, if there are treatment failures among the 'ossatron gang,' it certainly won't be the first time that has happened to any of us, so I was more than willing to take my chances.

Re: New Section for PF book

Bob G. on 3/23/00 at 00:00 (017715)

I think it fits, Scott; it is important to consider the good, bad, and the ugly amonst us. Some doctors could do us harm, most I believe won't - but, one must be proactive in distilling the difference. For example, if a taxi driver picks up passengers with little or no questions, he may not live to enjoy social security. A patient picks and chooses a physician, and a patient who blindly accepts this or that doctor without question reads his diagnosis in a fortune cookie. Personally, I want to live, so I size up people I deal with up front, including doctors. By the way, I was a cab driver and learned quickly to ask questions.