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Should I create a seperate message board?

Posted by Scott R on 6/10/00 at 10:45 (021604)

It seems like there are nearly as many 'other' posts being made as there are posts being made about foot pain. If there is enough interest in the other topics I can create a seperate message board.

Should I create a seperate message board for topics that are not about foot pain?
1) Yes, and keep this message board strictly for foot pain.
2) No, let's not limit our discussions in this board to foot pain.
3) No, just keep reminding everyone that the agreement for posting messages states they shouldn't be making posts that are not about foot pain.

Please select your response to the above survey question:
Results
.option 1 = 9 votes . . . voters: bbn.com, mail.summit-resources.com, cacheflow-01-cgy.nucleus.com, aol.com, mindspring.com, bitstorm.net, sdn-ar-002txcchrp171.dialsprint.net, home.com, home.com,
.option 2 = 6 votes . . . voters: cache.xecu.net, msstate.edu, , fix.net, sdn-ar-002txcchrp171.dialsprint.net, knvla010-0957.splitrock.net,
.option 3 = 11 votes . . . voters: , bbn.com, home.com, att.net, slip-35.bard.edu, rcn.com, aol.com, uu.net, psi.net, spc-isp-cal-58-2-1.sprint.ca, mindspring.com,
.option 4 = 0 votes . . . voters:

Re: ERROR MESSAGE?

Scott R on 6/10/00 at 11:52 (021605)

If you get an error message when trying the survey thing, please let me know.

Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

Beverly on 6/10/00 at 12:44 (021608)

Scott,

Opps. Subtract one vote for 'option 1'. I hit the wrong button. I corrected it, and revote for 'option 2' (make a seperate board).
Although I'm happy with the way we are now, and usually I can tell by a headline if it's about footpain, humor, or support, I guess it could make sense to have a separate board... perhaps something called 'support.' The problem is that there is a thin line between the actual foot pain itself and how it affects one emotionally and practically.
For instance, when my trip got cancelled and I came home worse than ever, the supportive letters I got from so many people meant a great deal to me. I was as much an emotional wreck over the experience as I was in terrible pain.

I've noticed we have some folks with good senses of humor and so they try to lighten our day with something funny. I think that what is happening is that as we 'regular posters' interact with each other, we are becoming like a little 'online family.' It doesn't matter to me whether you make a separate board for support or keep this one the way it is, but I would hate to be limited to just posting about the pain itself, because the experience of this condition and how it is affecting my quality of life, has just as much an impact on me as the pain itself.

Beverly


Re: Suggestion

Bob G. on 6/10/00 at 13:00 (021610)

This is a great message board. It is well organized and easy to navigate. I also participate and observe other message boards such as the Dodger Message Board.

One suggestion to make a good message board even better: Would it be possible for the Board to auto-email a Poster when a response is posted to a member's post? For example, on my Dodger Message Board, I receive an email when one of my posts is responded to.

This Board is my favorite because of the help I received in curing PF, the support from other members, and the ease of navigating, posting and reading.


Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

Nancy S. on 6/10/00 at 13:43 (021614)

Scott, I don't know how to respond to the survey. I guess I would vote somewhere between 2 and 3. I don't think a separate board would make sense -- foot pain affects one's whole life, so other maybe seemingly unrelated topics are going to sneak in there. And maybe they do a bit more now that your storage isn't the problem it was (a whole thread being stored as one message, right?).
I think the page we're on in the index maybe has less connection to foot pain -- but that doesn't usually seem the case, and topics are probably bound to wander now and then, and it can keep things interesting. Of course, most posts should be about foot pain, and I think are, but I'd hate to see people get paranoid about adding other tidbits or slices of humor. Foot pain can make some of us a little cuckoo now and then, as I don't need to tell you! You've seen it for years!
So I would vote to allow the 'family' feeling that grows here and the resulting sometimes farfetched segues; but I would also vote for you to remind posters of the main purpose of the board if you feel it ever is really getting off topic for too long a period of time.
A Request:
Would it make sense for you to change the 'back to message board index' box to appear at the END of 'view thread' instead of at the beginning? It sure would help me, with my low tech webtv.
Thanks for all your consideration, Scott..
--Nancy

Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

Scott R on 6/10/00 at 15:10 (021615)

I would have to do some extra programming to get the link at the bottom. Right now it just adds messages to the end of a file. I'm basically 'out of time' and am having to choose what gets left undone.

Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

john h on 6/10/00 at 15:44 (021616)

ditto beverly

Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

john h on 6/10/00 at 15:54 (021617)

aside from good medicine an equally important part of treating or living with any disease is the emotional well being of the individual. this board provides great medical information while at the same time providing emotionaly support for many. to make it 'strictly' a 'give me the facts only' board would greatly distract from the benefits it offers (IMHO). doctors should treat the whole person and in a sense that is what the board is doing. the board is a success! be careful about tampering with mother nature.

Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

Steve P on 6/10/00 at 17:28 (021621)

Ditto John H. I think the board is just fine as is.

Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

Kim B. on 6/10/00 at 17:53 (021622)

I was wondering how long you would put up with all our Tom Foolery before you nixed it. You're slipping Scott. Many of us understand very little about how you run this board, we just know you do it, and we're damn glad. Maybe you should enlighten us a little more about the rent space, bandwith, storage requirements or what ever it is you have to buy in order for us to have this forum. I know you mentioned once that many small posts is less desireable from your point of view. But I haven't seen you mention any of this lately.

Maybe you could create a weekly repeating post that outlines and reminds folks (informs newcomers) of your prefences for how the board should be used, i.e.'Hello Posters, Please stay close to the topic of PF and heelpain, Several small posts take up more space than one large posts, etc...', with a quick line about your mission statement tagged on. Many people may not have even be aware that you have any peferences.

Gang, I don't think Scott is concerned with the times that we include humor or personal details in our post that are about foot pain. It's probably the post that have NOTHING to do with foot pain, that, if done too often will break down the intregrity of the board. Popularity contest, wildlife about the home, Dog bit my face... OK, guilty - perfect example, but, I was starting to think that there was some sort of vacation curse on the board. (Vacations often being something that has to fall by the wayside for acute PF sufferers.)

Anyway, here is what I am really trying to get at. I can see where keeping it on track is very beneficial to newcomers. If I had found this board for the first time over the past few days, I would have thought it was very 'clickish' and that may have scared me off. This board being a serious place to discuss and learn about PF is what got me through the worst months of my PF. The newcomers deserve that too.

I think a seperate board would fragment things here. The newcomers need the oldtimers real bad. Thank God for the ones that helped me through Rookie PF school. If you segregate the board, the newcomers will loose in the long run.

Regards, Kim B.

Now go ahead and lamblast me gang, I'm tough as nails and can take anything you want to throw my way!! Ha Ha Ha!


Re: I'll go ahead and declare a position...

Scott R on 6/10/00 at 18:55 (021623)

Based on the vote and the comments our position seems to be this: keep the message board the way it is but limit the 'other' conversations with a reminder when necessary.

There is not a problem with too many messages right now because I delete them before the number of files limit is reached (it's 20,000 with this $30/month account). However, when the number of threads reaches 20,000, I'll have to start deleting them, which reduces the chances of people finding this web site through search engines, especially if the remaining threads have a lot of off-topic stuff.

But anyway, I'm against off-topic posts probably more-so than others because I believe useful information gets drowned out and hidden when too much other information is present. And, overall, it reduces the chances of people finding the website when searching on terms other than the three or four main ones related to the website because there is a limit on which files can be kept and I can't go through and delete off-topic posts. I hasten to add that all posts are compiled and kept in 4 huge files that can be seen if you do a search on something strange like 'sadfasdfasdfasdf'.


Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

Lynda S on 6/10/00 at 22:06 (021626)

3

Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

Beverly on 6/10/00 at 22:25 (021628)

Kim's post is well said and Scott has enlightened me on something I did not know. I for one have no idea how this thing gets made. I only know how to 'surf.' How cyberspace really operates is as foreign to me as how the TV station gets my favorite show into my TV. These are good points. I thought advertising probably paid for our board.

Now that I know a little bit about storage factors, it seems like support issues related to coping with PF is one thing, but purely silly posts and contests interfere with both storage and as Kim said, could appear to make us seem clickish.

Yet, I still would hate to see us not be able to discuss things like depression related to PF or how it affects family life. Those things really are related to PF if you think about it. Because our foot pain affects what we can and can't do with our families.. ie: sometimes vacation, and I do think Kim needed support when the dog bit her. That was traumatic. It was one thing too many on top of foot pain.

It is probably up to each of us individually to comply. If one person posts something purely silly or trivial, and then the rest of us respond, then we are gobbling up valuable storage space and confusing newbies. I plead guilty and will try to behave.


Beverly


Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

Nancy S. on 6/10/00 at 22:59 (021630)

I would like to add my two cents, for what it's worth, about the clique notion. Since finding this board, I have visited a number of other boards, and every single one of them couldn't begin to measure up to the welcoming atmosphere here and the intelligence and information displayed in the posts. I noticed that every board develops a kind of camaraderie, as happens here -- but few, if any, of the others are as accessible and welcoming. Countless posters here go out of their way to respond to newcomers and focus on and specifically address their concerns. I just don't see it as a tight-knit group that doesn't respond to and welcome newcomers. I think everyone here opens up and responds in record time to new posters, and tries to draw them in if they think it will be helpful. I think you are a good example, Beverly. It hasn't been all that long for you (though it probably feels like ages!), but it seems like many many people responded to and welcomed you right away, and you have become a regular. If the board had seemed very cliquish, would you still be here? I doubt it -- and I'm glad it didn't happen that way, because you add a lot here, as do many many people. I guess I just don't want to see camaraderie taken for cliquishness, if it isn't. Personally, I've never cared for cliquishness (you should have seen what a wallflower I was in high school because of it), but camaraderie -- I'm all for it, I welcome it and appreciate everyone on this board for all they have to offer. We all share a common problem, and each of us has a unique experience, perspective, and idea of the day or week to offer. I hope with all my heart that the spirit continues and that the problem ends for each and every one of us. --Nancy

Re: Depression is a HUGE factor in PF

Kim B. on 6/10/00 at 23:20 (021632)

You're right Beverly, depression is a huge factor for most of us. PF affects so much more than just the feet. I need to go look, but I'm not even sure if Scott's book addresses this angle. It's been a while since I read the dern thing. (New Chapter Scott?) Relationships (in general, especially marriages), child rearing, and livelyhoods are really tested by this illness. It helped me to know that I wasn't the only one who's life was pratically turned upside down by the pain, expense, and stress of it all.

He can correct me if I am wrong, but I've never gotten the impression that Scott minds if our post get personalized to some extent. I think it was just that one game was leading to another, plus, he (Scott) needed to know that some folks were not aware of his preferences.

Anyway, I'm glad you 'Got' that my post was was meant to inform, not criticize.

Regards, Kim B.


Re: Above post was in response was to Beverly's post. Got treaded wrong. (eom.)

Kim B. on 6/10/00 at 23:28 (021633)

eom means 'end of message' :-)

Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

Stephanie S. on 6/11/00 at 00:21 (021638)

Afraid I also am guilty of not keeping post to heel pain.
I don't feel like anything needs to be added or changed.
We just need a reminder every now and then. We all share
the same problem and sometimes we need a little humor or
support to get us through the day. So if we stumble a bit
here and there...please be patient. I for one...promise...
to keep on the foot subject. Sorry....Stephanie

Re: Good points from Kim and Nancy

Beverly on 6/11/00 at 12:10 (021646)

Nancy,

That's a good point. It has only been three months for me, and you all have been very welcoming. I have never seen a more friendly board than this one. It is also easy for my 'nongeek' self to navigate. That is another plus.

I think what others have posted about just not being purely silly for the sake of silliness is more what Scott is talking about. As we continue getting to know each other, we are bound to bring out our personalities in our posts, and that is good. It's what makes this both informative, supportive, and lively.

I only took a little bit of group theory in school, but I do recall that the longer a group is together, the more bonded it gets.

Kim's point about a need for a chapter on PF related depression is well said. It would be great if a therapist or master's level social worker could address a chapter on that. I think the depression that women get and what we deal with in our families and what men deal with is different... no worse or less worse... just different.

Women are expected to be caretakers in our families. Even us modern women are conditioned to do umpteen million things around the house, run umpteen million errands for the family, and for many women, also work outside the home. It is a major adjustment to suddenly not be able to do that... for us to suddenly be the ones in need of nurturing.

Men, on the other hand, are conditioned to be strong, tough, not talk or think about illness... to take care of the family by bringing home the bacon and mowing the lawn. It must be a very disabling thing to the male ego to suddenly not be able to be that person.

So yes, I think a section on depression and family life would be great.
It would be wonderful if something could be written addressed to the families themselves. But I still think that chapter would be best written by a professional in the mental health field.

Beverly


Re: Good points from Kim and Nancy

Nancy S. on 6/11/00 at 15:41 (021654)

I agree completely that the space devoted to PF-related depression in the PF book could be fattened up. I think it's the worst secondary ailment to arise from PF there is, and something most if not all of us have experienced. And unacknowledged/untreated depression can be so dangerous. . . .
I imagine that a lot of people who find this board are already depressed because of their condition. I know I was. And to read about it early, in the PF book, could be not only a comfort but, more important, educational. Because depression can make it so hard for a person to function, addressing it could not only ease the depression itself but make the person with PF more capable of helping him- or herself footwise.
--Nancy

Re: Depression section of the book

Scott R on 6/11/00 at 16:30 (021656)

I don't know what else can be said. Future reader's of the book (which will get published once I've done a lot of fixing and cleaning up) would probably appreciate a longer section. Here's what I've had written so far:

Psychological/Social Issues Table of Contents
Of course, not being able to walk as much as you would like can cause substantial psychological pain. This is sometimes compounded by an unusual lack of compassion on the part of physicians, family, friends, and/or co-workers that need or require you to walk. Common examples of insensitive attitudes include 'I've never seen a case like this before' or 'You're unusual' or 'It's just in your head' or 'You just need to walk more' or 'Why don't you just have your foot cut off and be done with it?' Heel pain seems to cause much more of these attitudes than other illnesses. This phenomenon has been indicated by many visitors in the message board area. Visitors are often grateful to be able to interact with other visitors who have experienced this and other psychological/social issues. Zoloft is one of the best anti-depressants, but good over-the-counter pills are 5-HTP, St. John's Wort, and Kava (Vitamin Shoppe brand only - herbs from many brands are notoriously ineffective). For stress, at least 1,000 mg vitamin C 4 times a day and a B-100 complex each day.


Re: Depression section of the book

Kim B. on 6/11/00 at 17:11 (021659)

Scott, I think the word 'depression' needs to be worked into the front of your text at least once. I, for one, have never liked it, but I often identiyfy with the word when I see it in print. I really like that you touched on the insensitivity issue. Beverly posted some good info earlier and you could steal from that since it all becomes your property once we post it anyway. Have you done a search on depression to see what 'pearls of wisdom' you have in your message files? I know I contributed at least a few. :-)! You get my point.

I like what you have written. Beverly makes a good point in that if you take this delicate topic very far, you probably should consult with a professional therapist. This may sound severe, but in my heart of hearts I would bet good money that, unrelenting, severe PF could drive someone to suiside, and I'll bet someone, somewhere has resorted to it in a moment of PF induced desperation. That's how difficult this illness can be at times.

You mention Zoloft, but Prozac is a very good anti-depressent too. Some will say Elavil is worth mentioning. I'm not asking for equal time or anything like that, I would just hesitate to metion one over another. You might say something like ...'Prescription anti-depressants are helpful for many people and for others, over the counter vitamin supplements can be helpful too. These supplements include things like 5 HTP, St. Johns Wort,... etc.

BTW, I recently heard that St. Johns Wort (like some antibotics) was found to render birth control pills ineffective. Just something to think about. Recommending nutrional supplements can be tricky when depression and reproductive issues are involved. A line like '...consult a certified nutritionist for advice regarding what nutritional supplements are helpful for deression...' is another way to go.

These are my suggestions, feel free to use them or discard them. I'm playing the devil's advocate a little I suppose. Again, search 'depression' and see what you have in your back pocket. The gang will also give you some good input now that you've asked for it.

Regards, Kim B.


Re: P.S.

Kim B. on 6/11/00 at 17:26 (021661)

I must admitt, I like my line 'PF affects more than just the feet.' Feel free to throw that in. (quit gagging)

And, you might work in something about how the expense of PF contributes to depression. Many things that help with PF are not covered by insurance. Shoes, inserts, supplements, massage, REST, etc. Just something to think about. You get the idea.

I used to be in the publishing business, 20 years, Pre-Motherhood. Anyway, I'm sorry if I get carried away with my suggestions. More input is better than not enough.

Kim B.


Re: Good points from Kim and Nancy

john h on 6/11/00 at 20:28 (021672)

pain in any long term form makes us all subject to depression. this board sort of serves as my surrogate psychothearpist on occasion. the board not only provides information but 'HOPE'! I do not talk much about my pain at home because no one reallly understands it.

Re: Newcomers

Bob G. on 6/11/00 at 22:32 (021682)

I agree with Nancy, This Board has always welcomed newcomers. How could anybody not feel welcome here? This is the place where people understand what it is and want to help each other. Whenever someone new enters, we all pay attention. We all learn. It's like finding a family that accepts you for what you are. It is easy to belong to this family and it is easy to contribute your experience.

All one has to do is post - and you're in!

(has anyone seen Bill Gate's gait?)



Re: Newcomers

Kim B. on 6/12/00 at 01:10 (021684)

Please allow me to clear something up. I NEVER said that newcomers were treated poorly here, I simply stated that I can see where keeping it (the board) on track is very beneficial to newcomers because, if I had found this board for the first time over the past few days, (at the time of my post) I would have thought it was very 'clickish' and that MAY have scared me off. I was speaking hypothetically. And no, I didn't weigh each and every word, ‘cause I never though that 'off the cuff remark' would be this misunderstood. Sorry if I sound defensive, but I think you guys are taking what I posted out of context.

Regards, Kim B.


Re: Newcomers

Bob G. on 6/12/00 at 01:58 (021686)

Hey, Kim! I know what you mean. Newcomers are welcome here. I don't think we are cliqueish (sp?)

If I were a newcomer I would feel right at home on this Board. Especially if I had Plantar Facsiitis (i do).

Originally from Mars, I am now residing in Morro Bay, California :-)


Re: How about a chat room?

john a on 6/15/00 at 11:24 (021860)

I don't know diddly about setting one up, but a real time chat room might be a good way to allow heelspurs.com message board participants to achieve even more intimate depression-relieving relationships with fellow sufferers.

Re: How about a chat room?

Nancy S. on 6/15/00 at 14:04 (021866)

john a! I can't do a live chat with webtv, but how in the world are you? I've wondered about you, you present-wrapping bandit. --Nancy

Re: How about a chat room?

john a on 6/15/00 at 16:32 (021873)

It's nice to be remembered, thanks. I haven't been reading the board much for the past two months or so. But not beause I've been cured. My feet are still pretty much the same as they have been for the past 14 months: I still can't walk or stand for more than five minutes without needing to sit down because of pain. Since reading the board wasn't helping much, I decided to try the 'don't associate with anyone with foot pain' approach. But that hasn't worked so far either :-) I've also been eating lots of garlic, soy nuts and green tea, to no apparant effect but a few extra pounds.

Re: How about a chat room?

Nancy S. on 6/15/00 at 17:00 (021875)

john a: Must be the soy nuts -- doesn't seem as though garlic or green tea would add pounds, not that I'm an expert. Were you hoping that 'not associating with anyone with foot pain' would get it off your mind and make it less stressful? I did that for a few weeks in March, I think it was, and it eased some kinds of stress and brought up others. I've been doing somewhat better, though -- less pain, but some bothersome new pains around the achilles and ankle. If you've been the same for 14 months, do you consider EWST? --Nancy

Re: How about a chat room?

wendyn on 6/15/00 at 22:15 (021895)

Glad to see you're still around John....sorry to hear the feet aren't improving much though.

Wendyn


Re: How about a chat room?

john a on 6/16/00 at 09:38 (021910)

Yes. 'You have to get away from the sick to get well.' 'Relief through disassociation.' 'Out of mind out of body.' 'Cease dwelling on one's misery.' Those were the ideas. They need further refinement....

ESWT is a remote thought, but I would probably try a cortisone shot first, but by a competent orthopedic foot and ankle surgeon instead of a lowly pod. Also wondering about ultrasound assisted cortisone shots, whereby they use live ultrasound to pinpoint the injection site, presumably increasing the likelihood of a beneficial result, and lessening the risk of a bad one.


Re: How about a chat room?

Susan S on 6/16/00 at 13:19 (021921)

My experience with shots (for what it's worth) The Pods were horrifically painful and not at all effective. The Orthos shot (just one) was uncomfortable and made both feet feel better.

Re: ERROR MESSAGE?

Scott R on 6/10/00 at 11:52 (021605)

If you get an error message when trying the survey thing, please let me know.

Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

Beverly on 6/10/00 at 12:44 (021608)

Scott,

Opps. Subtract one vote for 'option 1'. I hit the wrong button. I corrected it, and revote for 'option 2' (make a seperate board).
Although I'm happy with the way we are now, and usually I can tell by a headline if it's about footpain, humor, or support, I guess it could make sense to have a separate board... perhaps something called 'support.' The problem is that there is a thin line between the actual foot pain itself and how it affects one emotionally and practically.
For instance, when my trip got cancelled and I came home worse than ever, the supportive letters I got from so many people meant a great deal to me. I was as much an emotional wreck over the experience as I was in terrible pain.

I've noticed we have some folks with good senses of humor and so they try to lighten our day with something funny. I think that what is happening is that as we 'regular posters' interact with each other, we are becoming like a little 'online family.' It doesn't matter to me whether you make a separate board for support or keep this one the way it is, but I would hate to be limited to just posting about the pain itself, because the experience of this condition and how it is affecting my quality of life, has just as much an impact on me as the pain itself.

Beverly


Re: Suggestion

Bob G. on 6/10/00 at 13:00 (021610)

This is a great message board. It is well organized and easy to navigate. I also participate and observe other message boards such as the Dodger Message Board.

One suggestion to make a good message board even better: Would it be possible for the Board to auto-email a Poster when a response is posted to a member's post? For example, on my Dodger Message Board, I receive an email when one of my posts is responded to.

This Board is my favorite because of the help I received in curing PF, the support from other members, and the ease of navigating, posting and reading.


Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

Nancy S. on 6/10/00 at 13:43 (021614)

Scott, I don't know how to respond to the survey. I guess I would vote somewhere between 2 and 3. I don't think a separate board would make sense -- foot pain affects one's whole life, so other maybe seemingly unrelated topics are going to sneak in there. And maybe they do a bit more now that your storage isn't the problem it was (a whole thread being stored as one message, right?).
I think the page we're on in the index maybe has less connection to foot pain -- but that doesn't usually seem the case, and topics are probably bound to wander now and then, and it can keep things interesting. Of course, most posts should be about foot pain, and I think are, but I'd hate to see people get paranoid about adding other tidbits or slices of humor. Foot pain can make some of us a little cuckoo now and then, as I don't need to tell you! You've seen it for years!
So I would vote to allow the 'family' feeling that grows here and the resulting sometimes farfetched segues; but I would also vote for you to remind posters of the main purpose of the board if you feel it ever is really getting off topic for too long a period of time.
A Request:
Would it make sense for you to change the 'back to message board index' box to appear at the END of 'view thread' instead of at the beginning? It sure would help me, with my low tech webtv.
Thanks for all your consideration, Scott..
--Nancy

Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

Scott R on 6/10/00 at 15:10 (021615)

I would have to do some extra programming to get the link at the bottom. Right now it just adds messages to the end of a file. I'm basically 'out of time' and am having to choose what gets left undone.

Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

john h on 6/10/00 at 15:44 (021616)

ditto beverly

Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

john h on 6/10/00 at 15:54 (021617)

aside from good medicine an equally important part of treating or living with any disease is the emotional well being of the individual. this board provides great medical information while at the same time providing emotionaly support for many. to make it 'strictly' a 'give me the facts only' board would greatly distract from the benefits it offers (IMHO). doctors should treat the whole person and in a sense that is what the board is doing. the board is a success! be careful about tampering with mother nature.

Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

Steve P on 6/10/00 at 17:28 (021621)

Ditto John H. I think the board is just fine as is.

Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

Kim B. on 6/10/00 at 17:53 (021622)

I was wondering how long you would put up with all our Tom Foolery before you nixed it. You're slipping Scott. Many of us understand very little about how you run this board, we just know you do it, and we're damn glad. Maybe you should enlighten us a little more about the rent space, bandwith, storage requirements or what ever it is you have to buy in order for us to have this forum. I know you mentioned once that many small posts is less desireable from your point of view. But I haven't seen you mention any of this lately.

Maybe you could create a weekly repeating post that outlines and reminds folks (informs newcomers) of your prefences for how the board should be used, i.e.'Hello Posters, Please stay close to the topic of PF and heelpain, Several small posts take up more space than one large posts, etc...', with a quick line about your mission statement tagged on. Many people may not have even be aware that you have any peferences.

Gang, I don't think Scott is concerned with the times that we include humor or personal details in our post that are about foot pain. It's probably the post that have NOTHING to do with foot pain, that, if done too often will break down the intregrity of the board. Popularity contest, wildlife about the home, Dog bit my face... OK, guilty - perfect example, but, I was starting to think that there was some sort of vacation curse on the board. (Vacations often being something that has to fall by the wayside for acute PF sufferers.)

Anyway, here is what I am really trying to get at. I can see where keeping it on track is very beneficial to newcomers. If I had found this board for the first time over the past few days, I would have thought it was very 'clickish' and that may have scared me off. This board being a serious place to discuss and learn about PF is what got me through the worst months of my PF. The newcomers deserve that too.

I think a seperate board would fragment things here. The newcomers need the oldtimers real bad. Thank God for the ones that helped me through Rookie PF school. If you segregate the board, the newcomers will loose in the long run.

Regards, Kim B.

Now go ahead and lamblast me gang, I'm tough as nails and can take anything you want to throw my way!! Ha Ha Ha!


Re: I'll go ahead and declare a position...

Scott R on 6/10/00 at 18:55 (021623)

Based on the vote and the comments our position seems to be this: keep the message board the way it is but limit the 'other' conversations with a reminder when necessary.

There is not a problem with too many messages right now because I delete them before the number of files limit is reached (it's 20,000 with this $30/month account). However, when the number of threads reaches 20,000, I'll have to start deleting them, which reduces the chances of people finding this web site through search engines, especially if the remaining threads have a lot of off-topic stuff.

But anyway, I'm against off-topic posts probably more-so than others because I believe useful information gets drowned out and hidden when too much other information is present. And, overall, it reduces the chances of people finding the website when searching on terms other than the three or four main ones related to the website because there is a limit on which files can be kept and I can't go through and delete off-topic posts. I hasten to add that all posts are compiled and kept in 4 huge files that can be seen if you do a search on something strange like 'sadfasdfasdfasdf'.


Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

Lynda S on 6/10/00 at 22:06 (021626)

3

Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

Beverly on 6/10/00 at 22:25 (021628)

Kim's post is well said and Scott has enlightened me on something I did not know. I for one have no idea how this thing gets made. I only know how to 'surf.' How cyberspace really operates is as foreign to me as how the TV station gets my favorite show into my TV. These are good points. I thought advertising probably paid for our board.

Now that I know a little bit about storage factors, it seems like support issues related to coping with PF is one thing, but purely silly posts and contests interfere with both storage and as Kim said, could appear to make us seem clickish.

Yet, I still would hate to see us not be able to discuss things like depression related to PF or how it affects family life. Those things really are related to PF if you think about it. Because our foot pain affects what we can and can't do with our families.. ie: sometimes vacation, and I do think Kim needed support when the dog bit her. That was traumatic. It was one thing too many on top of foot pain.

It is probably up to each of us individually to comply. If one person posts something purely silly or trivial, and then the rest of us respond, then we are gobbling up valuable storage space and confusing newbies. I plead guilty and will try to behave.


Beverly


Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

Nancy S. on 6/10/00 at 22:59 (021630)

I would like to add my two cents, for what it's worth, about the clique notion. Since finding this board, I have visited a number of other boards, and every single one of them couldn't begin to measure up to the welcoming atmosphere here and the intelligence and information displayed in the posts. I noticed that every board develops a kind of camaraderie, as happens here -- but few, if any, of the others are as accessible and welcoming. Countless posters here go out of their way to respond to newcomers and focus on and specifically address their concerns. I just don't see it as a tight-knit group that doesn't respond to and welcome newcomers. I think everyone here opens up and responds in record time to new posters, and tries to draw them in if they think it will be helpful. I think you are a good example, Beverly. It hasn't been all that long for you (though it probably feels like ages!), but it seems like many many people responded to and welcomed you right away, and you have become a regular. If the board had seemed very cliquish, would you still be here? I doubt it -- and I'm glad it didn't happen that way, because you add a lot here, as do many many people. I guess I just don't want to see camaraderie taken for cliquishness, if it isn't. Personally, I've never cared for cliquishness (you should have seen what a wallflower I was in high school because of it), but camaraderie -- I'm all for it, I welcome it and appreciate everyone on this board for all they have to offer. We all share a common problem, and each of us has a unique experience, perspective, and idea of the day or week to offer. I hope with all my heart that the spirit continues and that the problem ends for each and every one of us. --Nancy

Re: Depression is a HUGE factor in PF

Kim B. on 6/10/00 at 23:20 (021632)

You're right Beverly, depression is a huge factor for most of us. PF affects so much more than just the feet. I need to go look, but I'm not even sure if Scott's book addresses this angle. It's been a while since I read the dern thing. (New Chapter Scott?) Relationships (in general, especially marriages), child rearing, and livelyhoods are really tested by this illness. It helped me to know that I wasn't the only one who's life was pratically turned upside down by the pain, expense, and stress of it all.

He can correct me if I am wrong, but I've never gotten the impression that Scott minds if our post get personalized to some extent. I think it was just that one game was leading to another, plus, he (Scott) needed to know that some folks were not aware of his preferences.

Anyway, I'm glad you 'Got' that my post was was meant to inform, not criticize.

Regards, Kim B.


Re: Above post was in response was to Beverly's post. Got treaded wrong. (eom.)

Kim B. on 6/10/00 at 23:28 (021633)

eom means 'end of message' :-)

Re: Should I create a seperate message board?

Stephanie S. on 6/11/00 at 00:21 (021638)

Afraid I also am guilty of not keeping post to heel pain.
I don't feel like anything needs to be added or changed.
We just need a reminder every now and then. We all share
the same problem and sometimes we need a little humor or
support to get us through the day. So if we stumble a bit
here and there...please be patient. I for one...promise...
to keep on the foot subject. Sorry....Stephanie

Re: Good points from Kim and Nancy

Beverly on 6/11/00 at 12:10 (021646)

Nancy,

That's a good point. It has only been three months for me, and you all have been very welcoming. I have never seen a more friendly board than this one. It is also easy for my 'nongeek' self to navigate. That is another plus.

I think what others have posted about just not being purely silly for the sake of silliness is more what Scott is talking about. As we continue getting to know each other, we are bound to bring out our personalities in our posts, and that is good. It's what makes this both informative, supportive, and lively.

I only took a little bit of group theory in school, but I do recall that the longer a group is together, the more bonded it gets.

Kim's point about a need for a chapter on PF related depression is well said. It would be great if a therapist or master's level social worker could address a chapter on that. I think the depression that women get and what we deal with in our families and what men deal with is different... no worse or less worse... just different.

Women are expected to be caretakers in our families. Even us modern women are conditioned to do umpteen million things around the house, run umpteen million errands for the family, and for many women, also work outside the home. It is a major adjustment to suddenly not be able to do that... for us to suddenly be the ones in need of nurturing.

Men, on the other hand, are conditioned to be strong, tough, not talk or think about illness... to take care of the family by bringing home the bacon and mowing the lawn. It must be a very disabling thing to the male ego to suddenly not be able to be that person.

So yes, I think a section on depression and family life would be great.
It would be wonderful if something could be written addressed to the families themselves. But I still think that chapter would be best written by a professional in the mental health field.

Beverly


Re: Good points from Kim and Nancy

Nancy S. on 6/11/00 at 15:41 (021654)

I agree completely that the space devoted to PF-related depression in the PF book could be fattened up. I think it's the worst secondary ailment to arise from PF there is, and something most if not all of us have experienced. And unacknowledged/untreated depression can be so dangerous. . . .
I imagine that a lot of people who find this board are already depressed because of their condition. I know I was. And to read about it early, in the PF book, could be not only a comfort but, more important, educational. Because depression can make it so hard for a person to function, addressing it could not only ease the depression itself but make the person with PF more capable of helping him- or herself footwise.
--Nancy

Re: Depression section of the book

Scott R on 6/11/00 at 16:30 (021656)

I don't know what else can be said. Future reader's of the book (which will get published once I've done a lot of fixing and cleaning up) would probably appreciate a longer section. Here's what I've had written so far:

Psychological/Social Issues Table of Contents
Of course, not being able to walk as much as you would like can cause substantial psychological pain. This is sometimes compounded by an unusual lack of compassion on the part of physicians, family, friends, and/or co-workers that need or require you to walk. Common examples of insensitive attitudes include 'I've never seen a case like this before' or 'You're unusual' or 'It's just in your head' or 'You just need to walk more' or 'Why don't you just have your foot cut off and be done with it?' Heel pain seems to cause much more of these attitudes than other illnesses. This phenomenon has been indicated by many visitors in the message board area. Visitors are often grateful to be able to interact with other visitors who have experienced this and other psychological/social issues. Zoloft is one of the best anti-depressants, but good over-the-counter pills are 5-HTP, St. John's Wort, and Kava (Vitamin Shoppe brand only - herbs from many brands are notoriously ineffective). For stress, at least 1,000 mg vitamin C 4 times a day and a B-100 complex each day.


Re: Depression section of the book

Kim B. on 6/11/00 at 17:11 (021659)

Scott, I think the word 'depression' needs to be worked into the front of your text at least once. I, for one, have never liked it, but I often identiyfy with the word when I see it in print. I really like that you touched on the insensitivity issue. Beverly posted some good info earlier and you could steal from that since it all becomes your property once we post it anyway. Have you done a search on depression to see what 'pearls of wisdom' you have in your message files? I know I contributed at least a few. :-)! You get my point.

I like what you have written. Beverly makes a good point in that if you take this delicate topic very far, you probably should consult with a professional therapist. This may sound severe, but in my heart of hearts I would bet good money that, unrelenting, severe PF could drive someone to suiside, and I'll bet someone, somewhere has resorted to it in a moment of PF induced desperation. That's how difficult this illness can be at times.

You mention Zoloft, but Prozac is a very good anti-depressent too. Some will say Elavil is worth mentioning. I'm not asking for equal time or anything like that, I would just hesitate to metion one over another. You might say something like ...'Prescription anti-depressants are helpful for many people and for others, over the counter vitamin supplements can be helpful too. These supplements include things like 5 HTP, St. Johns Wort,... etc.

BTW, I recently heard that St. Johns Wort (like some antibotics) was found to render birth control pills ineffective. Just something to think about. Recommending nutrional supplements can be tricky when depression and reproductive issues are involved. A line like '...consult a certified nutritionist for advice regarding what nutritional supplements are helpful for deression...' is another way to go.

These are my suggestions, feel free to use them or discard them. I'm playing the devil's advocate a little I suppose. Again, search 'depression' and see what you have in your back pocket. The gang will also give you some good input now that you've asked for it.

Regards, Kim B.


Re: P.S.

Kim B. on 6/11/00 at 17:26 (021661)

I must admitt, I like my line 'PF affects more than just the feet.' Feel free to throw that in. (quit gagging)

And, you might work in something about how the expense of PF contributes to depression. Many things that help with PF are not covered by insurance. Shoes, inserts, supplements, massage, REST, etc. Just something to think about. You get the idea.

I used to be in the publishing business, 20 years, Pre-Motherhood. Anyway, I'm sorry if I get carried away with my suggestions. More input is better than not enough.

Kim B.


Re: Good points from Kim and Nancy

john h on 6/11/00 at 20:28 (021672)

pain in any long term form makes us all subject to depression. this board sort of serves as my surrogate psychothearpist on occasion. the board not only provides information but 'HOPE'! I do not talk much about my pain at home because no one reallly understands it.

Re: Newcomers

Bob G. on 6/11/00 at 22:32 (021682)

I agree with Nancy, This Board has always welcomed newcomers. How could anybody not feel welcome here? This is the place where people understand what it is and want to help each other. Whenever someone new enters, we all pay attention. We all learn. It's like finding a family that accepts you for what you are. It is easy to belong to this family and it is easy to contribute your experience.

All one has to do is post - and you're in!

(has anyone seen Bill Gate's gait?)



Re: Newcomers

Kim B. on 6/12/00 at 01:10 (021684)

Please allow me to clear something up. I NEVER said that newcomers were treated poorly here, I simply stated that I can see where keeping it (the board) on track is very beneficial to newcomers because, if I had found this board for the first time over the past few days, (at the time of my post) I would have thought it was very 'clickish' and that MAY have scared me off. I was speaking hypothetically. And no, I didn't weigh each and every word, ‘cause I never though that 'off the cuff remark' would be this misunderstood. Sorry if I sound defensive, but I think you guys are taking what I posted out of context.

Regards, Kim B.


Re: Newcomers

Bob G. on 6/12/00 at 01:58 (021686)

Hey, Kim! I know what you mean. Newcomers are welcome here. I don't think we are cliqueish (sp?)

If I were a newcomer I would feel right at home on this Board. Especially if I had Plantar Facsiitis (i do).

Originally from Mars, I am now residing in Morro Bay, California :-)


Re: How about a chat room?

john a on 6/15/00 at 11:24 (021860)

I don't know diddly about setting one up, but a real time chat room might be a good way to allow heelspurs.com message board participants to achieve even more intimate depression-relieving relationships with fellow sufferers.

Re: How about a chat room?

Nancy S. on 6/15/00 at 14:04 (021866)

john a! I can't do a live chat with webtv, but how in the world are you? I've wondered about you, you present-wrapping bandit. --Nancy

Re: How about a chat room?

john a on 6/15/00 at 16:32 (021873)

It's nice to be remembered, thanks. I haven't been reading the board much for the past two months or so. But not beause I've been cured. My feet are still pretty much the same as they have been for the past 14 months: I still can't walk or stand for more than five minutes without needing to sit down because of pain. Since reading the board wasn't helping much, I decided to try the 'don't associate with anyone with foot pain' approach. But that hasn't worked so far either :-) I've also been eating lots of garlic, soy nuts and green tea, to no apparant effect but a few extra pounds.

Re: How about a chat room?

Nancy S. on 6/15/00 at 17:00 (021875)

john a: Must be the soy nuts -- doesn't seem as though garlic or green tea would add pounds, not that I'm an expert. Were you hoping that 'not associating with anyone with foot pain' would get it off your mind and make it less stressful? I did that for a few weeks in March, I think it was, and it eased some kinds of stress and brought up others. I've been doing somewhat better, though -- less pain, but some bothersome new pains around the achilles and ankle. If you've been the same for 14 months, do you consider EWST? --Nancy

Re: How about a chat room?

wendyn on 6/15/00 at 22:15 (021895)

Glad to see you're still around John....sorry to hear the feet aren't improving much though.

Wendyn


Re: How about a chat room?

john a on 6/16/00 at 09:38 (021910)

Yes. 'You have to get away from the sick to get well.' 'Relief through disassociation.' 'Out of mind out of body.' 'Cease dwelling on one's misery.' Those were the ideas. They need further refinement....

ESWT is a remote thought, but I would probably try a cortisone shot first, but by a competent orthopedic foot and ankle surgeon instead of a lowly pod. Also wondering about ultrasound assisted cortisone shots, whereby they use live ultrasound to pinpoint the injection site, presumably increasing the likelihood of a beneficial result, and lessening the risk of a bad one.


Re: How about a chat room?

Susan S on 6/16/00 at 13:19 (021921)

My experience with shots (for what it's worth) The Pods were horrifically painful and not at all effective. The Orthos shot (just one) was uncomfortable and made both feet feel better.