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post orthowave agony--please advise!

Posted by Nancy N on 8/27/00 at 10:03 (026330)

I had my second OrthoWave treatment yesterday for the FDA study. Everything went smoothly while I was there, but as soon as the lidocaine wore off, I had a lot of pain. It is different pain than what I'd been experiencing from the PF, but I'm not sure how to explain it. Sharper, maybe? And more evenly around the heel, though radiating from the most painful spot.

I'm wondering if perhaps the lidocaine injection irritated a nerve in my foot. I felt rather good when I got up yesterday morning, but since the injection wore off, I can barely walk (I've been on tip-toe and holding on to furniture/walls for support). I have been icing it, staying off it as much as possible, and trying to keep it elevated, but this is getting old, and the pain is not going away. The Celebrex, which previously made a marked difference, has had no effect on this new pain.

My last treatment was two weeks ago, and I had absolutely no problems that time. This is the worst pain I have ever experienced in my foot--I rated my starting pain at a 7, but this is easily a ten, maybe even an 11. I am worried about what might have happened to the nerve, and if it will heal on its own or if it might be damaged. There is no additional swelling in the foot.

Since it is Sunday, I can't get in touch with the doctors, so if anyone has any advice (especially doctors, if you read this board on Sundays!), please let me know (I am especially interested in what I can do to alleviate the pain so I can walk properly). I really appreciate it!


Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

Dr. Zuckerman on 8/27/00 at 10:25 (026332)

Stay off of your foot. Ice the foot. Call your doctors now. There is no such thing as off on the Weekend. I am here so they should be too.
You are going to need a stronger pain medication. Try vicoprofen tablets. two every six hours . Make sure you tell them that you have no allergies to codeine. If you can't get them the emergency room will give you the pain pills and take an x-ray of your foot. I hate er of weekends. So call the doctors and get the pills.

Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

Nancy N on 8/27/00 at 11:13 (026334)

Thanks so much for your quick response! So does my guess sound reasonable, that it's the nerve that's the problem?

I have tried calling, but only get voice mail and am not sure what else to try. I have not been to the ER but will go if you think that's the best bet (this is especially bad since I am out of town for a family gathering this weekend and will need to drive myself back to NJ tomorrow or Tuesday, if possible).

Thanks again for your help.


Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

Barbara on 8/27/00 at 16:23 (026391)

Hi...Sorry to hear that you are in so much pain. I had my elbow done there an hour after you and the treatment did hurt more than last time and my elbow is sorer than last time.

Drs. Erlich and Naidoo both work in the Dept. of Orthopaedic Surgery. Instead of calling the number on their business cards (which is probably their office numbers), call the Montefiore main number and ask to have them paged. If they are both out, ask for the Doctor on Call. Or try to have Craig Spurdle paged. I realize he's just a medical student, but he may know how to get in touch with Erlich or Naidoo. Since he's a student (I not sure if he's a resident or internist), he probably doesn't get a day off, so he should be there.

Try these numbers:
Erlichs email - (email removed)
Albert Einstein School of Medicine (Craig probably goes there) (718) 430-2000
Montefiore main numbers (they have 2 locations) (718) 920-4321 or (718) 904-2000

Hope this helps. Please keep us posted. If I can be of any help, please let me know.



Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

Nancy N on 8/27/00 at 16:59 (026393)

Thanks so much for your suggestions. I did try having Dr. Naidoo paged at Montefiore and at Jacoby, where they'd told me he is most days of the week. There was no response. I did not think of the others (and had a hard time finding some of the numbers as well), but did try the ER, where I spent a lot of time on hold and/or getting bounced between people. I finally gave up and decided to try again tomorrow, but maybe I will try some of your suggestions tonight. I wasn't sure how often Erlich checks his email, which is why I didn't try that one.

Interesting that you have more soreness, too. Craig did my injection this time, and I'm not sure if that has anything to do with it or not. The nerve idea makes sense to me, as I've had that happen when I've had blood samples taken, and it's as similar as I can come to the feeling I have now, except that this has not gone away overnight--probably because it is so difficult to keep off the foot (I'm visiting my parents for the weekend and have spent most of my time bored out of my skull while I ice it or try to keep it elevated--pretty well limits your options for activities!). It is especially disappointing considering how good I felt when I went in, so I am hoping this is just a temporary thing!!

Thanks again for the suggestions and phone numbers. I'll let you know how I make out.


Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

Barbara on 8/27/00 at 17:21 (026406)

Naidoo gave me the shot. The shot was painless (for a change) but the procedure was a 10. It hurt sooooo much. I think he saw the pain on my face, because half way through he altered the machine and the pain was reduced. But, I still feel like I received the placebo because there is no reduction in the pain from before the first treatment.

I'm surprised that Naidoo let Craig give the shot. This is supposed to be an FDA trial with certain controls...it's not a classroom lab for students.


Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

Nancy N on 8/27/00 at 17:28 (026409)

I just called and finally found Dr. Ehrlich. He of course can't really tell what's going on without seeing me and wanted me to come in tomorrow, but since I have been going on the train and the subway, I'm not sure that I would be able to do that, especially the standing for the subway and the walk from the subway to the hospital. So he said to let it go for another day or two, since it only happened yesterday, and see if it starts to feel any better, and if it doesn't by Tuesday, then I need to call him again (or I may just email him in the meantime).

I was kind of surprised that Naidoo didn't do the injection, too, but it never occurred to me to object. I guess I should have--though we don't know yet if that's what it was. I'm just hoping I feel good enough to drive home (2+ hours) tomorrow so I can at least be near the train if I need to go in again.

Thanks again for your suggestions.


Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

Dr. Zuckerman on 8/27/00 at 19:00 (026424)

Why can't you at least get some pain pills to help you out.

Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

Dr. Zuckerman on 8/27/00 at 19:03 (026425)

i doubt that it is a nerve problem. The question is do you have a fracture. Your foot was numb and you then walked on it. It would really be swollen and impossible to place weight on it if it were a fracture. . Just rest rest and ice ice.

Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

Nancy N on 8/28/00 at 06:58 (026452)

Based on your description, I don't think it can be a fracture. The foot looks exactly like it did before I went in on Saturday--no redness, no swelling, absolutely nothing to indicate to the eye (well, mine anyway) that anything might be wrong.

It is finally feeling better this morning, so I am hoping that the worst is past. I was hardly on it at all yesterday and spent a lot of time with the ice. I can understand them not wanting to prescribe anything to me without knowing what it was, though it was still quite frustrating just trying to get in touch with them. Anyway, I am not going to worry about it at this point unless it starts to get worse. Thanks very much to everyone for your help and advice.


Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

Robert Seaton on 9/29/00 at 15:40 (029453)

How are you doing now.??? I am thinking of having this procedure done

Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

LT on 10/04/00 at 19:40 (029794)

Reading your messages concerns me . I had the first treatment with Dr. Naidoo and I am waiting for the second treatment . I found that the shot wasn't that bad but the shock waves hurt me. They seemed very strong. How are you feeling now? I feel that I received the fake test because my foot is the same. After reading your message I'm a little worried. Hope you are okay now.

Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

Dr. Zuckerman on 8/27/00 at 10:25 (026332)

Stay off of your foot. Ice the foot. Call your doctors now. There is no such thing as off on the Weekend. I am here so they should be too.
You are going to need a stronger pain medication. Try vicoprofen tablets. two every six hours . Make sure you tell them that you have no allergies to codeine. If you can't get them the emergency room will give you the pain pills and take an x-ray of your foot. I hate er of weekends. So call the doctors and get the pills.

Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

Nancy N on 8/27/00 at 11:13 (026334)

Thanks so much for your quick response! So does my guess sound reasonable, that it's the nerve that's the problem?

I have tried calling, but only get voice mail and am not sure what else to try. I have not been to the ER but will go if you think that's the best bet (this is especially bad since I am out of town for a family gathering this weekend and will need to drive myself back to NJ tomorrow or Tuesday, if possible).

Thanks again for your help.


Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

Barbara on 8/27/00 at 16:23 (026391)

Hi...Sorry to hear that you are in so much pain. I had my elbow done there an hour after you and the treatment did hurt more than last time and my elbow is sorer than last time.

Drs. Erlich and Naidoo both work in the Dept. of Orthopaedic Surgery. Instead of calling the number on their business cards (which is probably their office numbers), call the Montefiore main number and ask to have them paged. If they are both out, ask for the Doctor on Call. Or try to have Craig Spurdle paged. I realize he's just a medical student, but he may know how to get in touch with Erlich or Naidoo. Since he's a student (I not sure if he's a resident or internist), he probably doesn't get a day off, so he should be there.

Try these numbers:
Erlichs email - (email removed)
Albert Einstein School of Medicine (Craig probably goes there) (718) 430-2000
Montefiore main numbers (they have 2 locations) (718) 920-4321 or (718) 904-2000

Hope this helps. Please keep us posted. If I can be of any help, please let me know.



Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

Nancy N on 8/27/00 at 16:59 (026393)

Thanks so much for your suggestions. I did try having Dr. Naidoo paged at Montefiore and at Jacoby, where they'd told me he is most days of the week. There was no response. I did not think of the others (and had a hard time finding some of the numbers as well), but did try the ER, where I spent a lot of time on hold and/or getting bounced between people. I finally gave up and decided to try again tomorrow, but maybe I will try some of your suggestions tonight. I wasn't sure how often Erlich checks his email, which is why I didn't try that one.

Interesting that you have more soreness, too. Craig did my injection this time, and I'm not sure if that has anything to do with it or not. The nerve idea makes sense to me, as I've had that happen when I've had blood samples taken, and it's as similar as I can come to the feeling I have now, except that this has not gone away overnight--probably because it is so difficult to keep off the foot (I'm visiting my parents for the weekend and have spent most of my time bored out of my skull while I ice it or try to keep it elevated--pretty well limits your options for activities!). It is especially disappointing considering how good I felt when I went in, so I am hoping this is just a temporary thing!!

Thanks again for the suggestions and phone numbers. I'll let you know how I make out.


Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

Barbara on 8/27/00 at 17:21 (026406)

Naidoo gave me the shot. The shot was painless (for a change) but the procedure was a 10. It hurt sooooo much. I think he saw the pain on my face, because half way through he altered the machine and the pain was reduced. But, I still feel like I received the placebo because there is no reduction in the pain from before the first treatment.

I'm surprised that Naidoo let Craig give the shot. This is supposed to be an FDA trial with certain controls...it's not a classroom lab for students.


Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

Nancy N on 8/27/00 at 17:28 (026409)

I just called and finally found Dr. Ehrlich. He of course can't really tell what's going on without seeing me and wanted me to come in tomorrow, but since I have been going on the train and the subway, I'm not sure that I would be able to do that, especially the standing for the subway and the walk from the subway to the hospital. So he said to let it go for another day or two, since it only happened yesterday, and see if it starts to feel any better, and if it doesn't by Tuesday, then I need to call him again (or I may just email him in the meantime).

I was kind of surprised that Naidoo didn't do the injection, too, but it never occurred to me to object. I guess I should have--though we don't know yet if that's what it was. I'm just hoping I feel good enough to drive home (2+ hours) tomorrow so I can at least be near the train if I need to go in again.

Thanks again for your suggestions.


Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

Dr. Zuckerman on 8/27/00 at 19:00 (026424)

Why can't you at least get some pain pills to help you out.

Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

Dr. Zuckerman on 8/27/00 at 19:03 (026425)

i doubt that it is a nerve problem. The question is do you have a fracture. Your foot was numb and you then walked on it. It would really be swollen and impossible to place weight on it if it were a fracture. . Just rest rest and ice ice.

Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

Nancy N on 8/28/00 at 06:58 (026452)

Based on your description, I don't think it can be a fracture. The foot looks exactly like it did before I went in on Saturday--no redness, no swelling, absolutely nothing to indicate to the eye (well, mine anyway) that anything might be wrong.

It is finally feeling better this morning, so I am hoping that the worst is past. I was hardly on it at all yesterday and spent a lot of time with the ice. I can understand them not wanting to prescribe anything to me without knowing what it was, though it was still quite frustrating just trying to get in touch with them. Anyway, I am not going to worry about it at this point unless it starts to get worse. Thanks very much to everyone for your help and advice.


Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

Robert Seaton on 9/29/00 at 15:40 (029453)

How are you doing now.??? I am thinking of having this procedure done

Re: post orthowave agony--please advise!

LT on 10/04/00 at 19:40 (029794)

Reading your messages concerns me . I had the first treatment with Dr. Naidoo and I am waiting for the second treatment . I found that the shot wasn't that bad but the shock waves hurt me. They seemed very strong. How are you feeling now? I feel that I received the fake test because my foot is the same. After reading your message I'm a little worried. Hope you are okay now.