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Heel pain & Fibromyalgia

Posted by PatC on 9/13/01 at 09:00 (060110)

I was wondering if anyone out there with heel problems also has fibromyalgia. Is there any relationship between the two? I have read different opinions. It seems like that when I have muscle pain throughout my body, the pain in my heel is worse. Any comments?

Re: Do a search

CArmen H on 9/13/01 at 09:23 (060114)

You should do a search on Fibromyalgia you will be reading for DAYS on all the information there. Obviously most of it is related to heel pain and you may be able to find some answers there. Do you have FM? I have done extensive research on it as I thought I had it for awhile...but I seriously doubt that I do.
Thankfully.

Re: Do a search

PatC on 9/13/01 at 09:44 (060117)

I haven't been formally diagnosed with it. My daughter has it and we both have similar symtoms. I'm in the process of finding a new GP as I don't get much help from the one I have now. I have done some research on FM, but will take your advice. You seen to be a walking encyclopedia with all kinds of information. Thanks for the help.

Re: walking encylopedia

Carmen on 9/13/01 at 12:47 (060138)

Wow a walking encyclopedia...that's a compliment. Thanks. I dod a LOT of reading and try to pass on what I learn if it can help others. Be careful that the docs don't diagnose your daughter or YOU wihtout ruling out ALL other possibilites first. There could be something worse or something not at all FM wrong.....I have found Doctors (three in the last two weeks) QUICK to try and diagnose FM b/c they don't have a quick answer to my problem. That to me is unnacceptable...and I said so.
Try http://www.webmd.com for information...it has a plethra of info on FM.
Also if yo uare interested I have a lot of supplements (vitamins) that are beneficial for FM I can send you the list.....
Has your daughter been tested for Undifferentiated Spondyloarthropathy? What about Myofascial Pain Syndrome?
Tested for Ankylosing Spondylitis? (sp?)
arthritis? Let me know if I can help further.....
Good luck.

Re: fibromyalgia and PF connection

JeanB on 9/13/01 at 19:15 (060210)

I read an article this year that hypothesized that NSAIDS--particularly aspirin and ibuprofen--taking many times daily over a long period of time (perhaps greater than 6 months)can be connected to the development of fibromyalgia. At my worst, I had PF for 1.5 years, had been popping aspirin and ibu several times a day, and every muscle in my body was so sensitive that I could hardly touch them. Since switching to Vioxx and getting a hydrotherapy spa, plus corrective soft tissue massage by physical therapist, I have said 'good-bye' to fibromyalgia symptoms. I believe there is a connection between the aspirin-ibuprofin consumption and the manifestation of fibromyalgia symptoms. In the same article, I believe they recommended an ingredient found in cough syrup (guanifessan?) was found to relieve the symptoms in some women.

Re: walking encylopedia

PatC on 9/13/01 at 21:50 (060243)

My daughters rheumatologist diagnosed her with FM by ANA blood test, tigger points and symtoms. Her flare ups usually happen when she doesn't get enough sleep or is under stress. Yes, I would be interested in helpful vitamins. Thanks

Re: fibromyalgia and PF connection

PatC on 9/13/01 at 21:55 (060244)

Thanks for the info. I too am taking Vioxx. It is the only NSAID that has helped me.

Re: Supplements

Carmen H on 9/14/01 at 14:50 (060339)

These are things that my vitamin Shaklee distributor recommended in case I was diagnosed with FM. She says FM is caused partly by taking Antibiotics.....so a cleansing of the body from all toxins is needed.
She recommends an opti flora program. I will provide her information for you if you'd like more detailed program and also to get vitamins from. She has been our provider of Shaklee for 30 years.
If you or your daughter are having trouble sleeping Valerian Root is a WONDERFUL tool for restful deep sleep. Magnesium Maleate is recommended for muscle relaxation and to increase the blood supply to the muscles. St. Johns Wort for mood disturbances or anxiety related to FM. Vitamin E 400-800 IU per day
Vitamin C to tolerance
Magnesium 300-900 mg per day
Coenzyme Q10.
Now these are all things that were recommended for patients of FM AFTER clearing with doctor that is treating your condition. ALWAYS ask about dosage and safety of supplements before implementing a program on your own.
I have been a vitamin taker for 27 years and feel so much better when I keep my body treated. These are just some ideas for you and your daughter....
Also may want to look at CBS health Watch web site.
they offer articles on FM. You have a lot of work to do to find what's best for you if you are just getting started on the treatment.....there's a lot out there...don't despair!

Re: Supplements

john h on 9/15/01 at 08:59 (060430)

Carmen there will be a lot of varying opinions on suppliments and herbs. The government position and most conventional doctors is that we are wasting our money. I for one have tried a lot of them and really never received any help. I am still using Jade which may offer some help and i still drink cherry extract (it taste good) because the U. of Michigan study said it had 10 times the anti inflamatory effect than aspirin. I still take one multi vitimin each day. This is an area where there are no FDA studies and you are your on.

Re: John

CArmen H on 9/15/01 at 09:30 (060436)

Yes...being raised on vitamins and kind of being a little earth child (my mother was very careful with my hypoglycemic childhood) I am VERY aware of the arguements against supplements and all the FDA stuff....I have heard both sides but stick to my experience. When I stopped taking them I got sick more often, had more trouble with joints and muscle aches etc. I believe in them and share my beliefs just in case it helps someone else. It's each to his own on vitamins though I agree. They say you shouldn't need vitamins or supplements if you have a proper diet...but I ask you this...WHO in this world REALLY sticks to EXACTLY what they need anymore? I know what I lack so I fill the void with supp. I haven't eaten red meat or pork in 11 years and I know I am iron and B12 deficient...so I make it up in vitamins. So I just give advice base on my experience and of course encourage people to ask their doctors first.
My doctors have been supportvie of vitamins since this happened with my hamstrings and feet.
Tell me what you think of the Jade? there are so many posts on it I would appreciate your personal opinion. thanks JOhn!!! ;-)

Re: John

john h on 9/15/01 at 10:59 (060444)

i do not knock suppliments or vitimins or any other non conventional treatments since there seems to be none that i have not tried. Many people seem to have found relief with various combinations. I say try anything. Do be aware that certain herbs can conflict with prescribed medications and reduce or multiply their effects. Shoe me a treament and i will try it! i am like mikee i will eat anything.

Re: Supplements

Nancy N on 9/15/01 at 11:03 (060447)

Carmen--

Do you (or anyone else) know anything about Alpha Lipoic Acid? I caught part of The Wrinkle Cure on PBS the other week, and the dermatologist who wrote the book of the same name kept talking about this stuff. He called it a powerful anti-inflammatory, but I don't know if that's just in terms of your skin, or if it can help inflammation in other tissues. I haven't been able to find any information online that isn't part of a sales pitch, so I don't know what to think. Any ideas?

Re: me too~

Carmen H on 9/15/01 at 16:08 (060483)

Heck I was going to dig into my cat's CAT NIP if that would help!!!
ha
I know what you mean....

Re: me too~

john h on 9/15/01 at 19:20 (060496)

i actually tried my cats dried cat food just so i knew what my baby was eating. it was terrible! my wife refused to come near me for a week. so if she bugs me anymore i just pop a little science diet in my mouth and no more problems with mary.

Re: Supplements

PatC on 9/15/01 at 20:53 (060512)

Thanks for all the information on supplements. There is a lot of information on this board to digest. It helps to know that I'm not the only one looking for answers. I have been visiting all of the suggested web sites and am just realizing how much information is out there.

Re: You;re hilarious John!

Carmen on 9/16/01 at 09:19 (060563)

thanks for the out loud laugh on a Sunday morning!!!
ha ha ha

Re: You;re hilarious John!

john h on 9/16/01 at 10:28 (060570)

carmen: we all need something to laugh about. Actually, it helps with the pain. So how are your feet these days and just what are you currently doing to help them. You know as a young woman who has taken on this problem early your chances for a full recovery are outstanding. If you had me as a houseboy to do all your work you would be cured next week.

Re: Re:our cat would get u

Tammie on 9/16/01 at 20:32 (060622)

John if u tryed to eat my familys cat he would eat you lol! He likes his chow and any other thing he can find and he really should think about some aerobic work outs or maybe this cat or ours should join a health club for felines tho his idea of workout would be go to find food use litter as he tries to find a way to fit his enlarging body thru his kitty door we laugh as we watch him! Now if u have a paper or magazine laying around he will help u dispose of it by shredding it , and of course he likes to think he has wings as he tries despartly to jump from things and does not quite make it landing as tho he just did a belly flop! He is a ham for sure and definetly a lazy thing when hot as he enjoys laying in the sun anywear he can fit! I bet he would like to get in your drink to but he wouldnt share!!!!! How funny you are I know my kids tried pet food but gee John if you are hungry I would be glad to cook for u and it wouldnt include cat chow! Think I may make some apple pies tomorrow as I have some nice ones from the apple farm. I better keep cat away or he will say those are his to!

Re: Re:our cat would get u

john h on 9/16/01 at 20:48 (060627)

Tammie: I will not eat cat chow i only go for the finer more refined Science Diet (anti hair ball variety) and as i posted he tried a little V.O today. This is much to expensive and i may switch him to Old Crow.

Re: Re:our cat would get u

nancy s. on 9/16/01 at 21:01 (060630)

such a relief that you won't be regurgitating hairballs! you riot, you.
switch him to boone's farm apple wine. that's what i drank in college. there's nothing cheaper, believe me.

Re: Nancy I have some apples

tammie on 9/16/01 at 21:58 (060635)

I have some apples maybe we could figure out how to make him some cheap wine? LOL But then John may want it and then maybe it would bring back good memories from school and u wil want to try some , hmmmmm wonder how many apples I might need hehehe

Re: Nancy I have some apples

nancy s. on 9/16/01 at 22:06 (060641)

all right tammie, thanks for stepping up to the plate! you cook, and we'll test, ok?
when i was a kid and wanted a snack and mom would hide the cookies from me, i'd sneak a dog biscuit. it wasn't bad -- probably better than cat chow.

Re: Nancy I have some apples

JudyS on 9/16/01 at 22:53 (060653)

Hmmmm......that explains a lot, NancyS! :)

Re: Nancy I have some apples

nancy s. on 9/16/01 at 23:16 (060660)

really, judy? i thought you must've seen several of my doglike qualities when you visited oh so long ago in june 2000. actually, you had a few yourself -- you sat on my floor, for one thing (madly typing posts to heelspurs.com).

Re: houseboy

Carmen on 9/17/01 at 07:26 (060672)

Hmmmmm now there's something I HADN'T thought about yet!!! I am not sure if my husband would like the title Houseboy...ha ha
I am not doing all that great. I am thinking my feet are only a small part of a larger nerve problem. If you have seen any of my posts you'll se I have been having other issues as well....and now it's gotten to the point of pain in wrists, feet, glutes, hamstrings etc. It feels like nerve pain though...not muscles. I feel GREAT! Besides the burning and tingling going on all over my body!
There's a HUGH possibility I may have injured myself awhile back (overdoing the exercising) or that I could have a neuropathy problem. I go to the NEurologist this week and back to the ortho.
Doctors...ugh.
But I am determined to figure it out...by myself if I have to.
Thanks for asking.....:-)

Re: Alpha Lipoic Acid

Carmen H on 9/17/01 at 07:29 (060673)

I have never heard of that stuff but if I were to take a guess...the name of it would suggest to me it is probably skin related only......
If you've noticed a lot of acne medicines have Alpha Hydroxy with salicylic (sp?) acid as part of the ingredients. Helps the inflammation in pimples and other skin related issues.
Sorry I couldn't be of more help.

Re: Re:our cat would get u

john h on 9/17/01 at 09:47 (060686)

nancy i only drik wine that has a screw off top. mogen david was my wine of choice in college.

Re: houseboy

john h on 9/17/01 at 10:01 (060691)

carmen: have you seen a neurologist?

Re: ON my way

CArmen on 9/17/01 at 12:13 (060720)

I am trying...I have had MORE trouble getting in with a neur. than you can imagine! I lie in atlanta and can't get s$%& for treatment or appt.s
I am overly frustrated.

Re: ON my way

john h on 9/17/01 at 14:40 (060744)

keep on trying carmen. with your various pains that sure seems the way to go.

Re: I think so too

Carmen on 9/17/01 at 15:03 (060750)

Yep I agree....I am just trying to cope until I get in to the next doc right now...

Re: Re:our cat would get u

john h on 9/17/01 at 19:09 (060789)

nancy: where do you get this Boone' Farm Apple Wine? Sounds good!! also sounds like it has a screw on top and not one of those pesky cork tops.

Re: Re:our cat would get u

nancy s. on 9/17/01 at 20:04 (060802)

oh yes, john, boone's farm apple wine has a twist-off cap, no pesky cork. i think it comes in a grape flavor also. you can get it if you fly yourself to the hudson valley, at least 2 or 3 hours north of nyc, and start walking the country roads. walk for at least two hours. make sure you pass some nonworking farms that have pigs rolling in mud by the side of the road. the first little corner store you come to, duck in there and get yourself some boone's farm. hmm hmm good.
nancy
p.s. please pick up an extra bottle and send it to me for old times' sake.

Re: Re:our cat would get u

JudyS on 9/18/01 at 10:38 (060843)

John - I have a bottle saved over from my high school after-prom beach party........

Re: Re:our cat would get u

john h on 9/19/01 at 12:55 (060950)

what is a beach party? how about a hay ride or sleigh ride? you do not have to deal with the sand.

Re: Do a search

CArmen H on 9/13/01 at 09:23 (060114)

You should do a search on Fibromyalgia you will be reading for DAYS on all the information there. Obviously most of it is related to heel pain and you may be able to find some answers there. Do you have FM? I have done extensive research on it as I thought I had it for awhile...but I seriously doubt that I do.
Thankfully.

Re: Do a search

PatC on 9/13/01 at 09:44 (060117)

I haven't been formally diagnosed with it. My daughter has it and we both have similar symtoms. I'm in the process of finding a new GP as I don't get much help from the one I have now. I have done some research on FM, but will take your advice. You seen to be a walking encyclopedia with all kinds of information. Thanks for the help.

Re: walking encylopedia

Carmen on 9/13/01 at 12:47 (060138)

Wow a walking encyclopedia...that's a compliment. Thanks. I dod a LOT of reading and try to pass on what I learn if it can help others. Be careful that the docs don't diagnose your daughter or YOU wihtout ruling out ALL other possibilites first. There could be something worse or something not at all FM wrong.....I have found Doctors (three in the last two weeks) QUICK to try and diagnose FM b/c they don't have a quick answer to my problem. That to me is unnacceptable...and I said so.
Try http://www.webmd.com for information...it has a plethra of info on FM.
Also if yo uare interested I have a lot of supplements (vitamins) that are beneficial for FM I can send you the list.....
Has your daughter been tested for Undifferentiated Spondyloarthropathy? What about Myofascial Pain Syndrome?
Tested for Ankylosing Spondylitis? (sp?)
arthritis? Let me know if I can help further.....
Good luck.

Re: fibromyalgia and PF connection

JeanB on 9/13/01 at 19:15 (060210)

I read an article this year that hypothesized that NSAIDS--particularly aspirin and ibuprofen--taking many times daily over a long period of time (perhaps greater than 6 months)can be connected to the development of fibromyalgia. At my worst, I had PF for 1.5 years, had been popping aspirin and ibu several times a day, and every muscle in my body was so sensitive that I could hardly touch them. Since switching to Vioxx and getting a hydrotherapy spa, plus corrective soft tissue massage by physical therapist, I have said 'good-bye' to fibromyalgia symptoms. I believe there is a connection between the aspirin-ibuprofin consumption and the manifestation of fibromyalgia symptoms. In the same article, I believe they recommended an ingredient found in cough syrup (guanifessan?) was found to relieve the symptoms in some women.

Re: walking encylopedia

PatC on 9/13/01 at 21:50 (060243)

My daughters rheumatologist diagnosed her with FM by ANA blood test, tigger points and symtoms. Her flare ups usually happen when she doesn't get enough sleep or is under stress. Yes, I would be interested in helpful vitamins. Thanks

Re: fibromyalgia and PF connection

PatC on 9/13/01 at 21:55 (060244)

Thanks for the info. I too am taking Vioxx. It is the only NSAID that has helped me.

Re: Supplements

Carmen H on 9/14/01 at 14:50 (060339)

These are things that my vitamin Shaklee distributor recommended in case I was diagnosed with FM. She says FM is caused partly by taking Antibiotics.....so a cleansing of the body from all toxins is needed.
She recommends an opti flora program. I will provide her information for you if you'd like more detailed program and also to get vitamins from. She has been our provider of Shaklee for 30 years.
If you or your daughter are having trouble sleeping Valerian Root is a WONDERFUL tool for restful deep sleep. Magnesium Maleate is recommended for muscle relaxation and to increase the blood supply to the muscles. St. Johns Wort for mood disturbances or anxiety related to FM. Vitamin E 400-800 IU per day
Vitamin C to tolerance
Magnesium 300-900 mg per day
Coenzyme Q10.
Now these are all things that were recommended for patients of FM AFTER clearing with doctor that is treating your condition. ALWAYS ask about dosage and safety of supplements before implementing a program on your own.
I have been a vitamin taker for 27 years and feel so much better when I keep my body treated. These are just some ideas for you and your daughter....
Also may want to look at CBS health Watch web site.
they offer articles on FM. You have a lot of work to do to find what's best for you if you are just getting started on the treatment.....there's a lot out there...don't despair!

Re: Supplements

john h on 9/15/01 at 08:59 (060430)

Carmen there will be a lot of varying opinions on suppliments and herbs. The government position and most conventional doctors is that we are wasting our money. I for one have tried a lot of them and really never received any help. I am still using Jade which may offer some help and i still drink cherry extract (it taste good) because the U. of Michigan study said it had 10 times the anti inflamatory effect than aspirin. I still take one multi vitimin each day. This is an area where there are no FDA studies and you are your on.

Re: John

CArmen H on 9/15/01 at 09:30 (060436)

Yes...being raised on vitamins and kind of being a little earth child (my mother was very careful with my hypoglycemic childhood) I am VERY aware of the arguements against supplements and all the FDA stuff....I have heard both sides but stick to my experience. When I stopped taking them I got sick more often, had more trouble with joints and muscle aches etc. I believe in them and share my beliefs just in case it helps someone else. It's each to his own on vitamins though I agree. They say you shouldn't need vitamins or supplements if you have a proper diet...but I ask you this...WHO in this world REALLY sticks to EXACTLY what they need anymore? I know what I lack so I fill the void with supp. I haven't eaten red meat or pork in 11 years and I know I am iron and B12 deficient...so I make it up in vitamins. So I just give advice base on my experience and of course encourage people to ask their doctors first.
My doctors have been supportvie of vitamins since this happened with my hamstrings and feet.
Tell me what you think of the Jade? there are so many posts on it I would appreciate your personal opinion. thanks JOhn!!! ;-)

Re: John

john h on 9/15/01 at 10:59 (060444)

i do not knock suppliments or vitimins or any other non conventional treatments since there seems to be none that i have not tried. Many people seem to have found relief with various combinations. I say try anything. Do be aware that certain herbs can conflict with prescribed medications and reduce or multiply their effects. Shoe me a treament and i will try it! i am like mikee i will eat anything.

Re: Supplements

Nancy N on 9/15/01 at 11:03 (060447)

Carmen--

Do you (or anyone else) know anything about Alpha Lipoic Acid? I caught part of The Wrinkle Cure on PBS the other week, and the dermatologist who wrote the book of the same name kept talking about this stuff. He called it a powerful anti-inflammatory, but I don't know if that's just in terms of your skin, or if it can help inflammation in other tissues. I haven't been able to find any information online that isn't part of a sales pitch, so I don't know what to think. Any ideas?

Re: me too~

Carmen H on 9/15/01 at 16:08 (060483)

Heck I was going to dig into my cat's CAT NIP if that would help!!!
ha
I know what you mean....

Re: me too~

john h on 9/15/01 at 19:20 (060496)

i actually tried my cats dried cat food just so i knew what my baby was eating. it was terrible! my wife refused to come near me for a week. so if she bugs me anymore i just pop a little science diet in my mouth and no more problems with mary.

Re: Supplements

PatC on 9/15/01 at 20:53 (060512)

Thanks for all the information on supplements. There is a lot of information on this board to digest. It helps to know that I'm not the only one looking for answers. I have been visiting all of the suggested web sites and am just realizing how much information is out there.

Re: You;re hilarious John!

Carmen on 9/16/01 at 09:19 (060563)

thanks for the out loud laugh on a Sunday morning!!!
ha ha ha

Re: You;re hilarious John!

john h on 9/16/01 at 10:28 (060570)

carmen: we all need something to laugh about. Actually, it helps with the pain. So how are your feet these days and just what are you currently doing to help them. You know as a young woman who has taken on this problem early your chances for a full recovery are outstanding. If you had me as a houseboy to do all your work you would be cured next week.

Re: Re:our cat would get u

Tammie on 9/16/01 at 20:32 (060622)

John if u tryed to eat my familys cat he would eat you lol! He likes his chow and any other thing he can find and he really should think about some aerobic work outs or maybe this cat or ours should join a health club for felines tho his idea of workout would be go to find food use litter as he tries to find a way to fit his enlarging body thru his kitty door we laugh as we watch him! Now if u have a paper or magazine laying around he will help u dispose of it by shredding it , and of course he likes to think he has wings as he tries despartly to jump from things and does not quite make it landing as tho he just did a belly flop! He is a ham for sure and definetly a lazy thing when hot as he enjoys laying in the sun anywear he can fit! I bet he would like to get in your drink to but he wouldnt share!!!!! How funny you are I know my kids tried pet food but gee John if you are hungry I would be glad to cook for u and it wouldnt include cat chow! Think I may make some apple pies tomorrow as I have some nice ones from the apple farm. I better keep cat away or he will say those are his to!

Re: Re:our cat would get u

john h on 9/16/01 at 20:48 (060627)

Tammie: I will not eat cat chow i only go for the finer more refined Science Diet (anti hair ball variety) and as i posted he tried a little V.O today. This is much to expensive and i may switch him to Old Crow.

Re: Re:our cat would get u

nancy s. on 9/16/01 at 21:01 (060630)

such a relief that you won't be regurgitating hairballs! you riot, you.
switch him to boone's farm apple wine. that's what i drank in college. there's nothing cheaper, believe me.

Re: Nancy I have some apples

tammie on 9/16/01 at 21:58 (060635)

I have some apples maybe we could figure out how to make him some cheap wine? LOL But then John may want it and then maybe it would bring back good memories from school and u wil want to try some , hmmmmm wonder how many apples I might need hehehe

Re: Nancy I have some apples

nancy s. on 9/16/01 at 22:06 (060641)

all right tammie, thanks for stepping up to the plate! you cook, and we'll test, ok?
when i was a kid and wanted a snack and mom would hide the cookies from me, i'd sneak a dog biscuit. it wasn't bad -- probably better than cat chow.

Re: Nancy I have some apples

JudyS on 9/16/01 at 22:53 (060653)

Hmmmm......that explains a lot, NancyS! :)

Re: Nancy I have some apples

nancy s. on 9/16/01 at 23:16 (060660)

really, judy? i thought you must've seen several of my doglike qualities when you visited oh so long ago in june 2000. actually, you had a few yourself -- you sat on my floor, for one thing (madly typing posts to heelspurs.com).

Re: houseboy

Carmen on 9/17/01 at 07:26 (060672)

Hmmmmm now there's something I HADN'T thought about yet!!! I am not sure if my husband would like the title Houseboy...ha ha
I am not doing all that great. I am thinking my feet are only a small part of a larger nerve problem. If you have seen any of my posts you'll se I have been having other issues as well....and now it's gotten to the point of pain in wrists, feet, glutes, hamstrings etc. It feels like nerve pain though...not muscles. I feel GREAT! Besides the burning and tingling going on all over my body!
There's a HUGH possibility I may have injured myself awhile back (overdoing the exercising) or that I could have a neuropathy problem. I go to the NEurologist this week and back to the ortho.
Doctors...ugh.
But I am determined to figure it out...by myself if I have to.
Thanks for asking.....:-)

Re: Alpha Lipoic Acid

Carmen H on 9/17/01 at 07:29 (060673)

I have never heard of that stuff but if I were to take a guess...the name of it would suggest to me it is probably skin related only......
If you've noticed a lot of acne medicines have Alpha Hydroxy with salicylic (sp?) acid as part of the ingredients. Helps the inflammation in pimples and other skin related issues.
Sorry I couldn't be of more help.

Re: Re:our cat would get u

john h on 9/17/01 at 09:47 (060686)

nancy i only drik wine that has a screw off top. mogen david was my wine of choice in college.

Re: houseboy

john h on 9/17/01 at 10:01 (060691)

carmen: have you seen a neurologist?

Re: ON my way

CArmen on 9/17/01 at 12:13 (060720)

I am trying...I have had MORE trouble getting in with a neur. than you can imagine! I lie in atlanta and can't get s$%& for treatment or appt.s
I am overly frustrated.

Re: ON my way

john h on 9/17/01 at 14:40 (060744)

keep on trying carmen. with your various pains that sure seems the way to go.

Re: I think so too

Carmen on 9/17/01 at 15:03 (060750)

Yep I agree....I am just trying to cope until I get in to the next doc right now...

Re: Re:our cat would get u

john h on 9/17/01 at 19:09 (060789)

nancy: where do you get this Boone' Farm Apple Wine? Sounds good!! also sounds like it has a screw on top and not one of those pesky cork tops.

Re: Re:our cat would get u

nancy s. on 9/17/01 at 20:04 (060802)

oh yes, john, boone's farm apple wine has a twist-off cap, no pesky cork. i think it comes in a grape flavor also. you can get it if you fly yourself to the hudson valley, at least 2 or 3 hours north of nyc, and start walking the country roads. walk for at least two hours. make sure you pass some nonworking farms that have pigs rolling in mud by the side of the road. the first little corner store you come to, duck in there and get yourself some boone's farm. hmm hmm good.
nancy
p.s. please pick up an extra bottle and send it to me for old times' sake.

Re: Re:our cat would get u

JudyS on 9/18/01 at 10:38 (060843)

John - I have a bottle saved over from my high school after-prom beach party........

Re: Re:our cat would get u

john h on 9/19/01 at 12:55 (060950)

what is a beach party? how about a hay ride or sleigh ride? you do not have to deal with the sand.