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Find a GOOD Aisian Medicine Doc???

Posted by Mike S. on 3/03/02 at 01:14 (075511)

I have bilateral TTS & have been seeing a very respected aisian doc and after four visits he tells me the reason I have this problem is because of my kidneys (the kidney system)! SO WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT THAT?

My Pod said we don't know why people get TTS (unless something is found taking up space in the tunnel). I go in for surgery of left foot in 2 weeks, mean while the aisian doc can do his medicine and maybe take care of the right and some other problems.

Re: Find a GOOD Aisian Medicine Doc???

Julie on 3/03/02 at 03:31 (075515)

Mike, I think it's perfectly possible, because just about everything that goes on in our bodies is related to everything else, although you wouldn't find many Western doctors who'd agree or do anything but laugh at you. If you yourself feel there is something in what your Asian doctor has said, you should give him a chance to do his stuff. That will take longer than two weeks, though, because whatever oriental system he practices (TCM, Ayurveda or other) what he will be doing is working on your energy levels to try to restore balance. That isn't a magic pill.

I would strongly urge you in any case to postpone surgery. Does your pod KNOW that there is something in the tunnel? Have you been tested and have the tests shown a mass there? Please don't rush into a last-resort solution that may compound your problems until you know exactly what's going on and have tried absolutely everything else that there is to try. I've gathered from reading these boards for a long time that TTS surgery is very problematic. Others know much more about it than I do, though, so I hope someone else will take over.

Wendy???

Re: Find a GOOD Aisian Medicine Doc???

Mike S. on 3/03/02 at 20:50 (075580)

Well, I don't think I'm rushing??? I've probably had this since early 2000. I didn't know I had TTS until eight months ago. I had bilateral neuroma's and we all thought that was my ONLY problem; but after the surgery, this is what was left since the neuroma's were gone.

There isn't much to try except orthotics and drugs. I've tried chiropractic medicine, now I've had my fifth visit to aisain medicine.

There is no obstruction in my tarsal tunnel, doc doesn't know what's causing it. How often does surgery make it WORSE? I've heard 70% success rate from my doc, but he shares the same concerns I have - no guarantees.

If I don't have the surgery, I just do nothing but wait. Can there be permanent nerve damage from leaving the nerve compressed?

My Dad just called as I'm writing this. He was watching a show on TV called Discovery 'Health' and there was this woman who had pains in her feet and this Doc said it was her liver not functioning right. WOW! Do western Doc's who specialize in TT releases know what causes TTS in the absence of a mass causing the problem???

Re: Find a GOOD Aisian Medicine Doc???

wendyn on 3/03/02 at 21:11 (075583)

Mike, if you haven't tried the orthotics yet - try them BEFORE surgery.

Yes - surgery can, and does make it worse in some cases.

Your chances of sucess go down if there is no identifiable mass in the tunnel

Yes - I think there is a higher chance of permanent damage from having the nerve compressed - but it sounds like there may not be a mass causing compression in your case.

If you don't have the surgery yet - it sounds to me like you've still got a lot of other things to try.

Have you had acupuncture yet?

Re: Find a GOOD Aisian Medicine Doc???

Mike S. on 3/03/02 at 21:22 (075585)

I've tried orthotics, they help some.

I'm trying accupuncture & his herbs now, I have 5 visits logged. He's the one that thinks my kidneys are the problem.

There is NO identifiable mass. I've tried various drugs that were little help.

What else is there? I've been reading posts were for months.

Re: Find a GOOD Aisian Medicine Doc???

Donna SL on 3/03/02 at 21:39 (075587)

Mike,

Has this doctor run blood, and other test to confirm that you have some type of kidney problem?

My nerves are recovering after being 'compressed' for a long time. Nerves do heal.

Donna

Re: Find a GOOD Aisian Medicine Doc???

Mike S. on 3/03/02 at 21:48 (075591)

Well, I'm just finding out about this. I just wrote a letter to an accupuncturist in my HMO asking him to interface with the western doc's. I need to check this out ASAP & get results in hand before the surgery. If I went to a doc myself, I'm fairly certain s/he would not make it a priority or take it seriously if I told them an Asian doc told me this.

I don't know what tests would be appropriate either.

Re: Mike, Wendy

Julie on 3/04/02 at 02:58 (075596)

Thanks Wendy - I was pretty much aware of all that, having remembered what you wrote about it some time ago - I wanted to say so to Mike, but wasn't absolutely sure, so I'm glad you came in. Mike - please forgive me for repeating myself and appearing to nag, but I REALLY feel you should postpone your surgery and not have it in two weeks.

1. You have no identifiable mass in the tarsal tunnel. As Wendy told you, this lowers your chance of success.

2. You have started on a treatment programme with your Asian doctor. Give it a chance to have some effect.

3. You have not yet tried orthotics. Get them, and give them a chance to work.

4. You may not have TTS. There seem to be an awful lot of cases of misdiagnosis, and it may just be a 'wastebasket' into which puzzling cases of foot pain are dumped.

5. You have nothing to lose by postponing.

Make sense? I hope so. I am afraid for you, having read too many reports of unnecessary or failed TTS surgery in the last 18 months - surgery that has left people with more pain and disability than they had before surgery.

Re: Mike, Wendy PS

Julie on 3/04/02 at 03:54 (075598)

Sorry, Mike: I missed the bit in your post that said you have tried orthotics.

Re: Find a GOOD Aisian Medicine Doc???

wendyn on 3/04/02 at 07:36 (075602)

Before I agreed to TTS surgery, if it were me - I would want all of the following FIRST:

Two opinions from different surgeons that were relatively similar stating the likely cause of my pain, and the appropriate surgical correction.

A realisitc explanation of the potential benefits, risks, and complications from surgery.

An MRI

A nerve conduction test

Full blood work and physical to try to make 99% sure that there wasn't a systemic cause being overlooked:

Diabetes
Thyroid
B12
Rhematoid Arthrits
Lupus

Then I would make sure that I had exhausted all conservative options before going for the surgery.

Almost 3 years ago, I came to this site hoping to find answers for my pain. Since then, I have seen WAY too many people come through here, have the surgery, and be more than disappointed with results.

The odd time, there is someone with a mass in the tunnel who responds really well to surgery - but for most it seems that after 6 months or a year they are back where they started.

Please think carefully about your decision - but either way...we are here for you and will be with you all the way.

Whether that's to hear about your great (or even not great) surgical results, or if you decide to postpone and pursue other options.t

Re: PLEASE, Read This & REPOST to Give Second Opinion

Mike S. on 3/04/02 at 08:13 (075603)

I've had 5 nerve conduction studies; the latest says this.

I am 43 & am willing to try the release since my quality of life is (&^$#*!!! with TTS. I have had several studies done, the last one exclusivly EMG, well maybe a few NCV ZAPS. Findings seem to be c/w distal tibial neuropathies bilaterally. Distal to Soleus/Flex Dig Longus/Post Tib. Primarily appears to involve FDIP/AH though unable to find insertional activity of left FDIP. Previous conduction studies showed significant slowing of medial & lateral plantar studies.

The $1,000,000 question is 'could this be related to a HORRIFFIC job I had in 93/94 where my feet were in such terrible pain from 12/7 for two 4 month periods running/walking on concrete.' The pain was excrutiating. Could symptoms be delayed 5 years? It's the only foot problems I've ever had.

I have had several biological tests, Thyroid, I think Lupus was one along with B12. Pod says MRI not useful. I wear orthotics.
I'm getting B12 done again. I am not diabetic.

Re: Mike I understand how u are feeling

Tammie on 3/04/02 at 09:24 (075607)

Mike , I am sorry that this pain has taken over your life and that you are at the point that you will try ANYTHING to find some kind of relief! I to was there and I did exactly what you are about to do.I do not want to make any decision for you , really I don't know the complete medical backround and if I did I still wouldnt understand it most likly!

But I can tell you that i was at the point where I did't care what they did as my life was gone anyways and the pain well what could be worse? Sleep , well it was in the past I knew not what that was like, and life , who had one certainly not me,work? What a joke, forcing each step and the pain which could take your breath away. So With this I would like to tell you about me.

I have said I was there, I did get the surgery, in fact I had 2 one to release the Pf and a spur,in April, the other was a tts release in Aug.
It is now March and may I tell you that the life that I thought was a cruel nightmare, has become a reality and maybe forever as what I am being told.I did not believe anything could make things worse, really I am being sincere, but my dear friend it has and I am fighting to stay IN life and trying to find a way to manage this horrible pain that has become my side kick. I was the person who refused to accept medications and who thought I could lick this , I never let anything bring me down, I was strong and not ever afraid of pain.

Well was I in for a surprise. This foot has made me a whimpering fool, looking for anyone or anything to fix it, but that is it it cant be just fixed, the damage is done, there have been 3 Dr.s now who have told me that they believe I have RSD,something I never though of as why should I ,it couldnt happen to ME. Wrong it seems to have, and now the pain that I thought was the worse , looking back I wish I could go back. I would have found pain management FIRST, get the pain in control and some sleep. I had a Dr. who did not understand what the Pain was really like for me, he did not want to treat the pain, he did not see the depression that I was in, he did not understand that I would have taken my own limb after being up with no sleep for many nights and days. He just thought it was time for more surgery and that would SOLVE the pain. Unfortuantly for me it did not it has magnified it by unbelievable amounts. I am trying to share this in hopes that you think about this , and if you havent yet maybe you will think about finding some pain relief and some help with the depression that goes with it.

It is a long hard road, and by now u may think well I am a woman so I am most likly a weak sniveling woman. I want to assure u I was not that,but I have become worse then that. Please take time to be SURE you have covered EVERYTHING . What is a couple of weeks to LIFE with so much pain at times you feel you cant breathe with out pain. Please read about Laurie, Janet and any others who know what could be worse.Also read about Wendyn who also knows what it is like and DID NOT get the surgery, PLEASE just take a peek, then if u still are uncertain I am sure some here can give you the websites where you can read about so many who have had surgery and now wish they had not given into the pain and are worse.

I must add that surgery is a option of course , and I am not saying dont do it , I am just asking that first get your pain in control and get some sleep and help if needed with depression that seems to be a part of this long term pain. Then when you are feeling more functional then make a informed dicision. Then you will have covered the bases and hopefully you will have a sucess in whatever it is that you do! If the surgery is the right option for you, you will have only given up a short time in your life and at least you get a time to be with less pain, and then you can deel with a surgery! You heel much better when you have had proper rest and understanding all that happens and what to expect from this surgery.
Again I must say, whatever you choose it is your choice and the support will be here from us all, and when you are comfortable with your choice you wont have that urgency of saying Please help me decide, as you will know in your heart that this is the right choice for YOU! Please dont be offended by anything I have said I really just want to help you, I am very uncertain as to what or how I should convey this, but I hope that you know You will be in my thoughts and prayers for the best of happiness and most of all to a life without cruel and ungiving pain. May the sun shine forever in your heart and best of luck in your search! Please keep the faith and know that we are friends.

Re: after re reading and again rereading I also want to

Tammie on 3/04/02 at 11:48 (075619)

Give you the side of positive, I am afraid I dont have the expierance to say yet that I have had the positive side and I do not want to sound as tho I am faulting my Dr. or anything else . As I have learned things happen some good some bad. I hope that others who hae had the positive side tell you this also!As most often the ones who have had positive expierance are no longer hanging around here! They have found there freedom and are out enjoying it! I am very very happy for them! I only wish that there were easy choices and easy cure alls. But from what i have found from my own research and my own feet, Nothing should be taken for granted, and that there are risks on both sides. But I have also learned that , I most likly would have taken time to find the RIGHT dr. to treat my feet and the other pains that happen with it. Along with making me take the time to fully understand both sides of the coin.

Meaning that telling me exactly what risks are involved for the positive and the negitive. The best and the worse . Along with alowing me to voice and really understand the pain that makes you do ANYTHING to get rid of it.I fault myself , not for the surgeries, but for not caring enough about myself, and my wellbeing to take time to get a clear head and use the knowledge with research and UNDERSTANDING what I learned. It did not sink in as I was so pain ridden and exhausted not only physicaly but mentally also. I am just now feeling that I may have a chance at learning more about my feet , my pain , both the physical side and the mental side and having some form of life that includes things I love and ut most returning to my family with some of the old me! So forgive me if I sounded so against surgery, I really am not, but I DO want you to hear about the OTHER side! Thank you for hearing me! My email is (email removed) if you ever need a friend.

Re: Find a GOOD Aisian Medicine Doc???

Julie on 3/03/02 at 03:31 (075515)

Mike, I think it's perfectly possible, because just about everything that goes on in our bodies is related to everything else, although you wouldn't find many Western doctors who'd agree or do anything but laugh at you. If you yourself feel there is something in what your Asian doctor has said, you should give him a chance to do his stuff. That will take longer than two weeks, though, because whatever oriental system he practices (TCM, Ayurveda or other) what he will be doing is working on your energy levels to try to restore balance. That isn't a magic pill.

I would strongly urge you in any case to postpone surgery. Does your pod KNOW that there is something in the tunnel? Have you been tested and have the tests shown a mass there? Please don't rush into a last-resort solution that may compound your problems until you know exactly what's going on and have tried absolutely everything else that there is to try. I've gathered from reading these boards for a long time that TTS surgery is very problematic. Others know much more about it than I do, though, so I hope someone else will take over.

Wendy???

Re: Find a GOOD Aisian Medicine Doc???

Mike S. on 3/03/02 at 20:50 (075580)

Well, I don't think I'm rushing??? I've probably had this since early 2000. I didn't know I had TTS until eight months ago. I had bilateral neuroma's and we all thought that was my ONLY problem; but after the surgery, this is what was left since the neuroma's were gone.

There isn't much to try except orthotics and drugs. I've tried chiropractic medicine, now I've had my fifth visit to aisain medicine.

There is no obstruction in my tarsal tunnel, doc doesn't know what's causing it. How often does surgery make it WORSE? I've heard 70% success rate from my doc, but he shares the same concerns I have - no guarantees.

If I don't have the surgery, I just do nothing but wait. Can there be permanent nerve damage from leaving the nerve compressed?

My Dad just called as I'm writing this. He was watching a show on TV called Discovery 'Health' and there was this woman who had pains in her feet and this Doc said it was her liver not functioning right. WOW! Do western Doc's who specialize in TT releases know what causes TTS in the absence of a mass causing the problem???

Re: Find a GOOD Aisian Medicine Doc???

wendyn on 3/03/02 at 21:11 (075583)

Mike, if you haven't tried the orthotics yet - try them BEFORE surgery.

Yes - surgery can, and does make it worse in some cases.

Your chances of sucess go down if there is no identifiable mass in the tunnel

Yes - I think there is a higher chance of permanent damage from having the nerve compressed - but it sounds like there may not be a mass causing compression in your case.

If you don't have the surgery yet - it sounds to me like you've still got a lot of other things to try.

Have you had acupuncture yet?

Re: Find a GOOD Aisian Medicine Doc???

Mike S. on 3/03/02 at 21:22 (075585)

I've tried orthotics, they help some.

I'm trying accupuncture & his herbs now, I have 5 visits logged. He's the one that thinks my kidneys are the problem.

There is NO identifiable mass. I've tried various drugs that were little help.

What else is there? I've been reading posts were for months.

Re: Find a GOOD Aisian Medicine Doc???

Donna SL on 3/03/02 at 21:39 (075587)

Mike,

Has this doctor run blood, and other test to confirm that you have some type of kidney problem?

My nerves are recovering after being 'compressed' for a long time. Nerves do heal.

Donna

Re: Find a GOOD Aisian Medicine Doc???

Mike S. on 3/03/02 at 21:48 (075591)

Well, I'm just finding out about this. I just wrote a letter to an accupuncturist in my HMO asking him to interface with the western doc's. I need to check this out ASAP & get results in hand before the surgery. If I went to a doc myself, I'm fairly certain s/he would not make it a priority or take it seriously if I told them an Asian doc told me this.

I don't know what tests would be appropriate either.

Re: Mike, Wendy

Julie on 3/04/02 at 02:58 (075596)

Thanks Wendy - I was pretty much aware of all that, having remembered what you wrote about it some time ago - I wanted to say so to Mike, but wasn't absolutely sure, so I'm glad you came in. Mike - please forgive me for repeating myself and appearing to nag, but I REALLY feel you should postpone your surgery and not have it in two weeks.

1. You have no identifiable mass in the tarsal tunnel. As Wendy told you, this lowers your chance of success.

2. You have started on a treatment programme with your Asian doctor. Give it a chance to have some effect.

3. You have not yet tried orthotics. Get them, and give them a chance to work.

4. You may not have TTS. There seem to be an awful lot of cases of misdiagnosis, and it may just be a 'wastebasket' into which puzzling cases of foot pain are dumped.

5. You have nothing to lose by postponing.

Make sense? I hope so. I am afraid for you, having read too many reports of unnecessary or failed TTS surgery in the last 18 months - surgery that has left people with more pain and disability than they had before surgery.

Re: Mike, Wendy PS

Julie on 3/04/02 at 03:54 (075598)

Sorry, Mike: I missed the bit in your post that said you have tried orthotics.

Re: Find a GOOD Aisian Medicine Doc???

wendyn on 3/04/02 at 07:36 (075602)

Before I agreed to TTS surgery, if it were me - I would want all of the following FIRST:

Two opinions from different surgeons that were relatively similar stating the likely cause of my pain, and the appropriate surgical correction.

A realisitc explanation of the potential benefits, risks, and complications from surgery.

An MRI

A nerve conduction test

Full blood work and physical to try to make 99% sure that there wasn't a systemic cause being overlooked:

Diabetes
Thyroid
B12
Rhematoid Arthrits
Lupus

Then I would make sure that I had exhausted all conservative options before going for the surgery.

Almost 3 years ago, I came to this site hoping to find answers for my pain. Since then, I have seen WAY too many people come through here, have the surgery, and be more than disappointed with results.

The odd time, there is someone with a mass in the tunnel who responds really well to surgery - but for most it seems that after 6 months or a year they are back where they started.

Please think carefully about your decision - but either way...we are here for you and will be with you all the way.

Whether that's to hear about your great (or even not great) surgical results, or if you decide to postpone and pursue other options.t

Re: PLEASE, Read This & REPOST to Give Second Opinion

Mike S. on 3/04/02 at 08:13 (075603)

I've had 5 nerve conduction studies; the latest says this.

I am 43 & am willing to try the release since my quality of life is (&^$#*!!! with TTS. I have had several studies done, the last one exclusivly EMG, well maybe a few NCV ZAPS. Findings seem to be c/w distal tibial neuropathies bilaterally. Distal to Soleus/Flex Dig Longus/Post Tib. Primarily appears to involve FDIP/AH though unable to find insertional activity of left FDIP. Previous conduction studies showed significant slowing of medial & lateral plantar studies.

The $1,000,000 question is 'could this be related to a HORRIFFIC job I had in 93/94 where my feet were in such terrible pain from 12/7 for two 4 month periods running/walking on concrete.' The pain was excrutiating. Could symptoms be delayed 5 years? It's the only foot problems I've ever had.

I have had several biological tests, Thyroid, I think Lupus was one along with B12. Pod says MRI not useful. I wear orthotics.
I'm getting B12 done again. I am not diabetic.

Re: Mike I understand how u are feeling

Tammie on 3/04/02 at 09:24 (075607)

Mike , I am sorry that this pain has taken over your life and that you are at the point that you will try ANYTHING to find some kind of relief! I to was there and I did exactly what you are about to do.I do not want to make any decision for you , really I don't know the complete medical backround and if I did I still wouldnt understand it most likly!

But I can tell you that i was at the point where I did't care what they did as my life was gone anyways and the pain well what could be worse? Sleep , well it was in the past I knew not what that was like, and life , who had one certainly not me,work? What a joke, forcing each step and the pain which could take your breath away. So With this I would like to tell you about me.

I have said I was there, I did get the surgery, in fact I had 2 one to release the Pf and a spur,in April, the other was a tts release in Aug.
It is now March and may I tell you that the life that I thought was a cruel nightmare, has become a reality and maybe forever as what I am being told.I did not believe anything could make things worse, really I am being sincere, but my dear friend it has and I am fighting to stay IN life and trying to find a way to manage this horrible pain that has become my side kick. I was the person who refused to accept medications and who thought I could lick this , I never let anything bring me down, I was strong and not ever afraid of pain.

Well was I in for a surprise. This foot has made me a whimpering fool, looking for anyone or anything to fix it, but that is it it cant be just fixed, the damage is done, there have been 3 Dr.s now who have told me that they believe I have RSD,something I never though of as why should I ,it couldnt happen to ME. Wrong it seems to have, and now the pain that I thought was the worse , looking back I wish I could go back. I would have found pain management FIRST, get the pain in control and some sleep. I had a Dr. who did not understand what the Pain was really like for me, he did not want to treat the pain, he did not see the depression that I was in, he did not understand that I would have taken my own limb after being up with no sleep for many nights and days. He just thought it was time for more surgery and that would SOLVE the pain. Unfortuantly for me it did not it has magnified it by unbelievable amounts. I am trying to share this in hopes that you think about this , and if you havent yet maybe you will think about finding some pain relief and some help with the depression that goes with it.

It is a long hard road, and by now u may think well I am a woman so I am most likly a weak sniveling woman. I want to assure u I was not that,but I have become worse then that. Please take time to be SURE you have covered EVERYTHING . What is a couple of weeks to LIFE with so much pain at times you feel you cant breathe with out pain. Please read about Laurie, Janet and any others who know what could be worse.Also read about Wendyn who also knows what it is like and DID NOT get the surgery, PLEASE just take a peek, then if u still are uncertain I am sure some here can give you the websites where you can read about so many who have had surgery and now wish they had not given into the pain and are worse.

I must add that surgery is a option of course , and I am not saying dont do it , I am just asking that first get your pain in control and get some sleep and help if needed with depression that seems to be a part of this long term pain. Then when you are feeling more functional then make a informed dicision. Then you will have covered the bases and hopefully you will have a sucess in whatever it is that you do! If the surgery is the right option for you, you will have only given up a short time in your life and at least you get a time to be with less pain, and then you can deel with a surgery! You heel much better when you have had proper rest and understanding all that happens and what to expect from this surgery.
Again I must say, whatever you choose it is your choice and the support will be here from us all, and when you are comfortable with your choice you wont have that urgency of saying Please help me decide, as you will know in your heart that this is the right choice for YOU! Please dont be offended by anything I have said I really just want to help you, I am very uncertain as to what or how I should convey this, but I hope that you know You will be in my thoughts and prayers for the best of happiness and most of all to a life without cruel and ungiving pain. May the sun shine forever in your heart and best of luck in your search! Please keep the faith and know that we are friends.

Re: after re reading and again rereading I also want to

Tammie on 3/04/02 at 11:48 (075619)

Give you the side of positive, I am afraid I dont have the expierance to say yet that I have had the positive side and I do not want to sound as tho I am faulting my Dr. or anything else . As I have learned things happen some good some bad. I hope that others who hae had the positive side tell you this also!As most often the ones who have had positive expierance are no longer hanging around here! They have found there freedom and are out enjoying it! I am very very happy for them! I only wish that there were easy choices and easy cure alls. But from what i have found from my own research and my own feet, Nothing should be taken for granted, and that there are risks on both sides. But I have also learned that , I most likly would have taken time to find the RIGHT dr. to treat my feet and the other pains that happen with it. Along with making me take the time to fully understand both sides of the coin.

Meaning that telling me exactly what risks are involved for the positive and the negitive. The best and the worse . Along with alowing me to voice and really understand the pain that makes you do ANYTHING to get rid of it.I fault myself , not for the surgeries, but for not caring enough about myself, and my wellbeing to take time to get a clear head and use the knowledge with research and UNDERSTANDING what I learned. It did not sink in as I was so pain ridden and exhausted not only physicaly but mentally also. I am just now feeling that I may have a chance at learning more about my feet , my pain , both the physical side and the mental side and having some form of life that includes things I love and ut most returning to my family with some of the old me! So forgive me if I sounded so against surgery, I really am not, but I DO want you to hear about the OTHER side! Thank you for hearing me! My email is (email removed) if you ever need a friend.