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A little confused.

Posted by Jolene H. on 4/05/02 at 18:25 (078609)

I am totally clueless regarding this ESWT. I saw the Early Show today and thought that this sounded like a miracle. Was I not understanding what the featured patient had done? I thought that she said that she had one treatment from Dr. Gregory Theodore, walked out of the treatment and after about a week has had no pain? I am like everyone else on this site suffer from heel pain and I will receive my second injection of cortisone on Monday. The doctor told me that if this doesn't take care of the situtation, surgery was the only option left. When I heard this, I was very hopeful. After reading all of the postings, this doesn't exactly sound like a miracle treatment with people having multiple treatments, taping feet, physical therapy, etc. What is the likely hood that the Early Show patient had such a wonderful success?

Re: Jolene~!!

Carmen on 4/05/02 at 18:35 (078612)

Hey there! You have SOOO many options before you need to consider surgery. NO ONE will recommend that and if they do recommend it before you have tried everything else conservatively FIND another doctor!
What is your treatment history? Have you tried Orthotics? Physical Therapy? Walking Cast? Iontophoresis? Ultrasound? GOOD shoes? Stretching?
Please give us your history and ask why the doc wants to give you another shot?
ESWT is not a 'miracle' for everyone but does help from what I have heard. Dr. Z is the board doctor you should ask about ESWT but read about it first by clicking on the link below E.S.W.T. and get educated.
Surgery is LAST resort for PF sufferers...as the show said...the results aren't as good as ESWT and are invasive.
There are many reasons PF happens and we are all different...find out the CAUSE of yours, read the PF book and about ESWT....but don't head for surgery until you get more informed. Stick around here and read...ask questions we do a pretty good job of responding! ;-)
It is by far the best board you will find on feet!
Good luck...keep us posted!
Carmen

Re: A little confused.

BrianG on 4/05/02 at 19:33 (078622)

Hi Jolene,

What you saw on TV was probably true, but not accurate as far as most patients are concerned. If Dr. Theodore was going to bring a patient on TV with him, it stands to reason, he will bring his best case. Did they talk about cost at all? MGH could be charging up to $10,000 to have both feet done. I haven't been able to get the cost estimate from them (MGH) yet, but it's probably some what accurate. Add to that a procedure that is not guaranteed, or covered by many insurance companies. What you probably saw was the best case scenerio, and there is really nothing wrong with that, as long as everyone knows all the facts.

BrianG

Re: A little confused.

Betty S. on 4/05/02 at 20:04 (078624)

I called MGH re: Dr Theodore and it is 3000 per foot so somewhat less than 10000 but what are the disadvantages of going to Canada? Betty S.

Re: A little confused.

Dr. Zuckerman on 4/05/02 at 22:42 (078634)

About 20-25% of patients will feel this way from day one . The rest of the cures will take six to twelve weeks for complete relief

Re: A little confused.

Mike J on 4/06/02 at 00:48 (078640)

I just scheduled my eswt treatment with Dr Z for next friday so I found this segment very interesting. I do however think either CBS or the Dr featured is to blame for irresponsible reporting and almost borderline unethical or at least false advertising. If I did not know any better I would think this is a miricle cure and five minutes after the procedure is done I will be completely pain free.

Like Dr Z said this does happen some times but they really should have said its not common and most people require 8-12 weeks to get the full benenfit. Even in the sleazy diet adds when they show how someone lost 100 lbs in 6 months with a pill they still state in small print at the bottom that these results are not typical and your results may vary.

From what I have read I think ESWT is a great thing or I would not be canceling my summer vacation and using the money to get this done. But I think they do have a responsibility to at least inform viewers what more common results are.

Am I alone on my ethical standpoint with this or do most people agree with me?

Re: A little confused.

Dr. Zuckerman on 4/06/02 at 06:40 (078644)

I didn't see the segment but the doctor has the duty to explain as much as he can about the healing time etc. How long was this segment ?

Re: A little confused.

Mike J on 4/06/02 at 08:11 (078652)

The segment was about 3-4 min long. I missed it in the morning also but the vedeo of the entire segment is on the web. Just go to
http://www.cbsnews.com/earlyshow/healthwatch/healthnews/20020405hw_footherapy.shtml
and click on the video link at the top of the page to watch.

Re: A little confused.

Sunny Jacob - Bayshore on 4/06/02 at 09:10 (078654)

Specific answer to your question regarding treatment in Canada:
There are no disadvantages to having your treatment done in Canada.
The advantages are: You will save money and at the same time you will have an opportunity to see a part of your beautiful, friendly neighbouring country.

Re: A little confused.

Dr. Zuckerman on 4/06/02 at 10:53 (078669)

I saw it thanks

Lets hope her another foot heals as quickly

Re: A little confused.

Jolene H. on 4/06/02 at 11:53 (078677)

First let me thank everyone for their response. I had this problem about 15 years ago and it was cleared up with an anti-inflamatory medication in a relatively short time. I have not been bothered with this since then. During this time I was fairly active walking a couple of miles three or four times a week. It seemed like all of a sudden I started having pain. Had an x-ray taken and the same spur was very evident looking just like the x-ray 15 years ago. The Dr. gave me medication and asked me to soak it a couple of times per day for a month and wear a gel heal pad. This didn't do much. He then gave me a cortisone shot in the spot that was the most tender. I continue to take naproxin and wear the heal pad which does helps. It has been 6 weeks since my first shot. There has been improvement, but still have pain especially if I have been on my feet alot. The Dr. said that he would give a second shot, but if that didn't work, there were no alternatives other than surgery. I had heard that this surgery was not all that succesful. Now thanks to this board, I know differently and will continue to read on the subject. I had no idea that it was so common. I can already tell that perhaps my problem is not as severe as alot of people and perhaps I am alittle impatient. I appreciate all comments and advise. I believe Dr. Z said in most instances it takes 6-12 weeks for results of ESWT. Is this waiting time the result of one treatment or do you need to continue treatment during this entire time? How many treatments does it usually take?

Re: A little confused.

Dr. Zuckerman on 4/06/02 at 12:20 (078680)

Most people will see some kind of improvement from week one to six. may be small. Most will see the greatest improvment from week six to week twelve.

We are doing a one treatment and wait for the improvment then another one if needed at week twelve. There is always the exception with number of treatments

Re: also..........

JudyS on 4/06/02 at 15:17 (078691)

......did everyone notice that the Mass.Gen. machine Dr. Theodore uses is the Dornier?

Re: A little confused.

JudyS on 4/06/02 at 15:27 (078694)

A very good point, Mike - you're not alone with your thinking at all. I agree with John h - the darn FDA really ought to have some patient input with ESWT and the interviewer on the CBS show should have dug a little more for information. If Mass. Gen is charging such an astronomical amount of money, why wasn't it said so on the program - they're certainly not going to broadcast the cost or the 'average' results if they're not asked.
Having said that, I'm awfully glad that ESWT is getting more and more press. There was a pretty good article in the local paper here in San Diego a few weeks ago about the spiffy new Ossotron/heel spur treatment available in a local sports clinic. But that article did, in fact, quote the (horrible) price and the average results.

Re: also..........

Dr. Zuckerman on 4/06/02 at 16:00 (078697)

I noticed it. The funny part was that they kept calling him a podiatrist. How dam them mistake an orthopedic surgeon for a podiatrist. Just kidding but how can they make a mistake like that.

Re: A little confused.

Dr. Zuckerman on 4/06/02 at 16:04 (078699)

This was a press release not an interview . Only going to get the positive

Re: JudyS

Jolene H. on 4/07/02 at 11:31 (078738)

I would be interested in reading the article you mentioned in the San Diego paper on Ossotron/heel spur treamtnet. Could you post the day that it appeared.

Re: JudyS

JudyS on 4/07/02 at 21:00 (078779)

Jolene - I'll check it out......I may have the article still buried on my desk somewhere. Would you like to email me with a fax number?
(email removed)

Re: A little confused.

Nancy C on 4/12/02 at 19:57 (079496)

I suffer from heel spurs also and have had 3 cortisone shots and taping. Funny, that no one has mentioned foot wear. MY podiatrist told me to buy 'running sneakers' and that seemed to cure 60% of my problem (cortisone helped about 20% more). He told me to buy 'New Balance' Running Sneakers 'Saucany (Grid)' and 'Brooks (Pro Walkers)' because they had the best support/stability. Gave me a few different models to buy. Cant remember all of them but I bought New Balance 587 and they seem to feel like I've been wearing them all my life and my heel spur pain has diminished alot. They (new balance) come in different widths also. Bought them at the NB factory outlet and saved $$$. He also told me to change my sneakers often because they end up losing stability and support after a while. I have a feeling that my style of reebok walking sneakers that I was buying for years is what cause my heel spur.

Re: Jolene~!!

Carmen on 4/05/02 at 18:35 (078612)

Hey there! You have SOOO many options before you need to consider surgery. NO ONE will recommend that and if they do recommend it before you have tried everything else conservatively FIND another doctor!
What is your treatment history? Have you tried Orthotics? Physical Therapy? Walking Cast? Iontophoresis? Ultrasound? GOOD shoes? Stretching?
Please give us your history and ask why the doc wants to give you another shot?
ESWT is not a 'miracle' for everyone but does help from what I have heard. Dr. Z is the board doctor you should ask about ESWT but read about it first by clicking on the link below E.S.W.T. and get educated.
Surgery is LAST resort for PF sufferers...as the show said...the results aren't as good as ESWT and are invasive.
There are many reasons PF happens and we are all different...find out the CAUSE of yours, read the PF book and about ESWT....but don't head for surgery until you get more informed. Stick around here and read...ask questions we do a pretty good job of responding! ;-)
It is by far the best board you will find on feet!
Good luck...keep us posted!
Carmen

Re: A little confused.

BrianG on 4/05/02 at 19:33 (078622)

Hi Jolene,

What you saw on TV was probably true, but not accurate as far as most patients are concerned. If Dr. Theodore was going to bring a patient on TV with him, it stands to reason, he will bring his best case. Did they talk about cost at all? MGH could be charging up to $10,000 to have both feet done. I haven't been able to get the cost estimate from them (MGH) yet, but it's probably some what accurate. Add to that a procedure that is not guaranteed, or covered by many insurance companies. What you probably saw was the best case scenerio, and there is really nothing wrong with that, as long as everyone knows all the facts.

BrianG

Re: A little confused.

Betty S. on 4/05/02 at 20:04 (078624)

I called MGH re: Dr Theodore and it is 3000 per foot so somewhat less than 10000 but what are the disadvantages of going to Canada? Betty S.

Re: A little confused.

Dr. Zuckerman on 4/05/02 at 22:42 (078634)

About 20-25% of patients will feel this way from day one . The rest of the cures will take six to twelve weeks for complete relief

Re: A little confused.

Mike J on 4/06/02 at 00:48 (078640)

I just scheduled my eswt treatment with Dr Z for next friday so I found this segment very interesting. I do however think either CBS or the Dr featured is to blame for irresponsible reporting and almost borderline unethical or at least false advertising. If I did not know any better I would think this is a miricle cure and five minutes after the procedure is done I will be completely pain free.

Like Dr Z said this does happen some times but they really should have said its not common and most people require 8-12 weeks to get the full benenfit. Even in the sleazy diet adds when they show how someone lost 100 lbs in 6 months with a pill they still state in small print at the bottom that these results are not typical and your results may vary.

From what I have read I think ESWT is a great thing or I would not be canceling my summer vacation and using the money to get this done. But I think they do have a responsibility to at least inform viewers what more common results are.

Am I alone on my ethical standpoint with this or do most people agree with me?

Re: A little confused.

Dr. Zuckerman on 4/06/02 at 06:40 (078644)

I didn't see the segment but the doctor has the duty to explain as much as he can about the healing time etc. How long was this segment ?

Re: A little confused.

Mike J on 4/06/02 at 08:11 (078652)

The segment was about 3-4 min long. I missed it in the morning also but the vedeo of the entire segment is on the web. Just go to
http://www.cbsnews.com/earlyshow/healthwatch/healthnews/20020405hw_footherapy.shtml
and click on the video link at the top of the page to watch.

Re: A little confused.

Sunny Jacob - Bayshore on 4/06/02 at 09:10 (078654)

Specific answer to your question regarding treatment in Canada:
There are no disadvantages to having your treatment done in Canada.
The advantages are: You will save money and at the same time you will have an opportunity to see a part of your beautiful, friendly neighbouring country.

Re: A little confused.

Dr. Zuckerman on 4/06/02 at 10:53 (078669)

I saw it thanks

Lets hope her another foot heals as quickly

Re: A little confused.

Jolene H. on 4/06/02 at 11:53 (078677)

First let me thank everyone for their response. I had this problem about 15 years ago and it was cleared up with an anti-inflamatory medication in a relatively short time. I have not been bothered with this since then. During this time I was fairly active walking a couple of miles three or four times a week. It seemed like all of a sudden I started having pain. Had an x-ray taken and the same spur was very evident looking just like the x-ray 15 years ago. The Dr. gave me medication and asked me to soak it a couple of times per day for a month and wear a gel heal pad. This didn't do much. He then gave me a cortisone shot in the spot that was the most tender. I continue to take naproxin and wear the heal pad which does helps. It has been 6 weeks since my first shot. There has been improvement, but still have pain especially if I have been on my feet alot. The Dr. said that he would give a second shot, but if that didn't work, there were no alternatives other than surgery. I had heard that this surgery was not all that succesful. Now thanks to this board, I know differently and will continue to read on the subject. I had no idea that it was so common. I can already tell that perhaps my problem is not as severe as alot of people and perhaps I am alittle impatient. I appreciate all comments and advise. I believe Dr. Z said in most instances it takes 6-12 weeks for results of ESWT. Is this waiting time the result of one treatment or do you need to continue treatment during this entire time? How many treatments does it usually take?

Re: A little confused.

Dr. Zuckerman on 4/06/02 at 12:20 (078680)

Most people will see some kind of improvement from week one to six. may be small. Most will see the greatest improvment from week six to week twelve.

We are doing a one treatment and wait for the improvment then another one if needed at week twelve. There is always the exception with number of treatments

Re: also..........

JudyS on 4/06/02 at 15:17 (078691)

......did everyone notice that the Mass.Gen. machine Dr. Theodore uses is the Dornier?

Re: A little confused.

JudyS on 4/06/02 at 15:27 (078694)

A very good point, Mike - you're not alone with your thinking at all. I agree with John h - the darn FDA really ought to have some patient input with ESWT and the interviewer on the CBS show should have dug a little more for information. If Mass. Gen is charging such an astronomical amount of money, why wasn't it said so on the program - they're certainly not going to broadcast the cost or the 'average' results if they're not asked.
Having said that, I'm awfully glad that ESWT is getting more and more press. There was a pretty good article in the local paper here in San Diego a few weeks ago about the spiffy new Ossotron/heel spur treatment available in a local sports clinic. But that article did, in fact, quote the (horrible) price and the average results.

Re: also..........

Dr. Zuckerman on 4/06/02 at 16:00 (078697)

I noticed it. The funny part was that they kept calling him a podiatrist. How dam them mistake an orthopedic surgeon for a podiatrist. Just kidding but how can they make a mistake like that.

Re: A little confused.

Dr. Zuckerman on 4/06/02 at 16:04 (078699)

This was a press release not an interview . Only going to get the positive

Re: JudyS

Jolene H. on 4/07/02 at 11:31 (078738)

I would be interested in reading the article you mentioned in the San Diego paper on Ossotron/heel spur treamtnet. Could you post the day that it appeared.

Re: JudyS

JudyS on 4/07/02 at 21:00 (078779)

Jolene - I'll check it out......I may have the article still buried on my desk somewhere. Would you like to email me with a fax number?
(email removed)

Re: A little confused.

Nancy C on 4/12/02 at 19:57 (079496)

I suffer from heel spurs also and have had 3 cortisone shots and taping. Funny, that no one has mentioned foot wear. MY podiatrist told me to buy 'running sneakers' and that seemed to cure 60% of my problem (cortisone helped about 20% more). He told me to buy 'New Balance' Running Sneakers 'Saucany (Grid)' and 'Brooks (Pro Walkers)' because they had the best support/stability. Gave me a few different models to buy. Cant remember all of them but I bought New Balance 587 and they seem to feel like I've been wearing them all my life and my heel spur pain has diminished alot. They (new balance) come in different widths also. Bought them at the NB factory outlet and saved $$$. He also told me to change my sneakers often because they end up losing stability and support after a while. I have a feeling that my style of reebok walking sneakers that I was buying for years is what cause my heel spur.