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taping question

Posted by BrianJ on 1/02/03 at 14:49 (104603)

In order for me to get any relief with taping, I've found the tape must be fairly tight. However, very soon this tightness causes the tape to start 'sliding' on my foot, so after an hour or so it is longer useful. I've tried Leuko tape, sports tape, and duct tape, but nothing seems to help. I've also tried putting multiple short strips in an 'East/West' direction to support the main strips (a little better but still not sufficient). Has anyone else encountered this problem, and what is the best way to deal with it?

Re: taping question

Barb on 1/02/03 at 14:54 (104605)

What is Leuko tape? Where do you buy it?

Re: taping question

dave r on 1/02/03 at 15:43 (104609)

Brian, i have been taping my feet for 4 years. Its the only thing that has helped me. It at least gives me the ability to walk a little more. I tape around the balls of my feet first. this helps the tape to stick better. have you ever tried a spray adhesive? that really helps to. if i know i will be doing alot of walking i will tape around my arches to help hold the tape to. I buy tape by the case. 24 rolls at a time. How is your foot feeling since you had your surgery?

Re: taping question

Pauline on 1/02/03 at 15:49 (104610)

Brian,
I found relief from using probably the cheapest sports tape around. The others you mentioned always pulled the skin off my feet. The cheap one stuck, gave me the support that I require and came off without hurting my skin.

I purchased it from Target in one of their pharmacy isles where the Dr. Scholls products are kept. The one I used is their own brand, it's an
1 1/2 ' wide and costs about $1.59 I think.

As I said, this cheap stuff worked great for me. I found the trick was to dry my feet very well after my shower, use Dr. Reynolds cream in the middle of my arch where the pain was and then apply the tape according to Scott's X taping method. I used 2 longer pieces to form the X beginning at the ball of my foot and wrapping it around the back of my heel. I'd apply it without flexing my foot toward my ankle and pull it tight but comfortable. I'd then rub my hand up and down my foot to make sure it's attached well, then I added 3 more strips across the arch area to support it.

From trial an error I learned that somedays I needed to apply more tape strips across my arch and on most days 3 would do it. I put my socks on immediately over the tape being careful not to make it roll up. Roll your sock down to the toe, stretch it as wide as you can and gently put your toes in and roll the sock up your foot making sure the tape stays in place. Then put your foot down flat on the floor putting pressure on the tape to help it remain in place. Put your shoes on and go.

On some days for extra support I actually did a second taping on top of the sock. When you need extra support you might try this. It's more difficult to remove the tape from your sock than your foot, but don't just tape the outside of your sock leaving your foot un taped. It will not supply enough support because your sock will slip.

My success story with taping. If you try it your only investing a small amount because the tape is so cheap.

Hope it helps you as it did me. If weight plays a factor in using this cheap tape it may not work for men.

Re: taping question

john h on 1/02/03 at 17:13 (104614)

Brian: I am no taping expert but Julie and I both found when we taped to tight or ran the tape up the back of the heel it would cause the achilles tendon to act up. I followed the advice I have seen several places and that is to dorsiflex the foot when taping so that when the tape is on and you relax your foot there is enough give that the tape is not pulling. I use the simple two strip method where I run one strip from the base of the great toe to just over the back of the heel. I run the other strip from just below the little toe to just over the back of the heel. i use 1 1/2' leuko tape. It is simple and can be easily done. Of course this may not work for you but do be wary of taping real tight especially if the foot is not dorsiflexed when you apply it.

Re: taping question

john h on 1/02/03 at 17:14 (104615)

I order it Barb from a medical supply house as I cannot find it in the drugstores. i think the web page is http://www.gnc.com

If that does not get you there let me know and I will give you there phone number.

Re: taping question

Leon S. on 1/02/03 at 17:56 (104618)

John, I agree with your technique. Based on your suggestion, I started taping about a week ago.I'm using regular athletic tape and the difference is remarkable. Against everyone's advice, I did go skiing on Sunday and I did not have any negative aftereffects. With the taping, I find that I am able to wear certain sneakers and shoes that I haven't been able to use in months without any appreciable pain.

Re: taping question

IanJ on 1/02/03 at 19:44 (104648)

I use the exact same strategy. Over-tightning does NOT work for me.

Re: taping question

BrianJ on 1/03/03 at 09:28 (104687)

dave r -- in answer to your question, my surgery has not produced any noticeable benefit as of yet. The 'surgical' heel still has slightly more pain than it did before surgery.

Re: taping question

dave r on 1/03/03 at 10:32 (104696)

Whats your next step going to be?
Are you planning to give it a year to see what happens?

Re: taping question

BrianJ on 1/03/03 at 12:55 (104711)

I'm not sure what my next step will be. I certainly will not get further surgery unless something really changes, as neither EPF nor Baxter Surgery has helped thus far. Actually, I'm thinking of experimenting with something that will give the benefits of taping but be more effective and more convenient. I don't want to get into it right now, as it's only an idea, and will require a lot of experimentation and refinement. You know, the Wright brothers were not the smartest and most formally trained guys, but they were creative and tenacious. Maybe that's what it will take to beat PF.

Re: taping question

dave r on 1/03/03 at 15:46 (104729)

Great idea, i will buy one if it works..
Do you think that some of the medial fibers where missed when you had your epf?

Re: taping question

BrianJ on 1/03/03 at 21:06 (104756)

Dave --

I don't think it was just missed fibers. My pain in both feet has progressed to cover all of the area just in front of the heel bone (medial, central and lateral). It's pretty much the same in both feet -- the sugical foot AND the nonsurgical foot. I think chronic strain probably resulted in the tissue becoming thick, tough and inflamed. I'm not sure much can be done to fix this (or at least manage it effectively), but I'm sure going to try.

By the way, don't let me scare you away from having surgery. At some point, when you've had this problem as long as we have, and you've tried all conservative treatments, it's reasonable to give surgery a try.

Re: taping question

Ed Davis, DPM on 1/03/03 at 22:49 (104761)

Brian:

Are you using a pre- tape spray? That will increase tape adhesion, decrease skin irritation and keep the tape in place.

The manner in which the tape is applied can be more important than tightness. Some of the minimalistic techniques work for some but the gold standard for taping of plantar fasciitis is the low dye taping.
Step 1: coat your foot with pre- tape spray - available at most sporting goods stores.
Step 2: apply the heel lock
This involves running a one inch strip around the circumference of your foot starting just behind the big toe joint, going around the back of the heel bone and ending just behind the 5th toe joint.

Your foot should be hanging down in a relaxed postion so that the arch is raised as you apply the taping.

Step3:
Take 2 inch strips and run them transversely across your foot starting with the heel, going forward to the level of the toe joints -- pull the tape gently from lateral to medial to invert the foot. Overlap the strips by about half their width. The ends of the transverse strips should end up on the heel lock portion.

Step 4: optional but helpful
Use 3 inch Elastoplast (available at many pharmacies) which is an elastic tape and run it around the forefoot area, just behind the toe joints -- that will help keep the tape in place.

Step 5:
Repeat steps 1 through 3 and finish with a heel lock strip to 'seal' the ends of the transverse strips.

Step 6:
Rub paraffin or candle wax over the whole thing several times -- this keeps the tape from catching your sock and partially waterproofs the taping -- lasts a lot longer.

Ed

Re: taping question

Ed Davis, DPM on 1/03/03 at 22:52 (104762)

John:

The strip that goes around the back of the heel needs to go right over the heel bone -- achilles irritation means that that strip was placed a bit too high on the heel.
Ed

Re: taping question

Ed Davis, DPM on 1/03/03 at 22:56 (104763)

Brian:
I have not followed your case across the boards. have you tried/considered ESWT?

Are you getting a good degree of relief from taping? We tape for two reasons: 1) to provide relief and 2) as a test to see if relief of plantar fascial tension is effective -- a pre-test to determine the effectiveness of orthotics.
Ed

Re: taping question

nancy s. on 1/03/03 at 23:24 (104764)

ed, thanks for this, especially for #6. i could not come up with a solution to the problem of the tape sticking to my socks. i'm very glad to have one.

nancy
.

Re: taping question

john h on 1/04/03 at 09:12 (104789)

Brian you have mentioned one of the great mysteries about PF that have always puzzeled me. I have bilateral PF. Surgery on one foot and multiple eswt on both feet. When one foot hurts the other foots hurts equally. If one feels better the other feels better. There is no good explanation for this. I did have one Podiatrist who was giving me a shot say to me 'I will only give you a shot in one foot because frequently when I give a shot in one foot for some reason the other foot is better also'. He said he did not know the reason but had just discovered that over many years of treating PF. Common sense says that one foot should at least be somewhat more or less painful than the other.

Re: taping question

john h on 1/04/03 at 09:16 (104790)

I agree with you DR Ed. Through experience of taping to high on the heel I quickly discovered that you can create an achilles proble. I tape it much as you descbribe. I also use a tape spray remover because if you leave the residue on you sure can irritate your feet. My tape never has a problem staying on as I dorsiflex the foot when putting it on. Getting it off is the trick. Careful here because if you rip that baby off in a hurry you can take some skin and I am here to tell you that is painful for some days and is slow healing.

Re: taping question

BrianJ on 1/04/03 at 10:46 (104809)

Dr. Ed --

Thanks very much for your valuable pointers on taping. Yes, I have tried ESWT multiple times -- two OssaTron treatments here in Dallas and also a series of three low energy treatments at the Bayshore Clinic in Toronto. They did not help me. Of course, I have also had blood tests, MRIs, X-rays and a bone scan to rule out others problems. I then had the 'Baxter Surgery' in Houston about three months ago, and have had no relief thus far. Over the years, I have had many pairs of custom orthotics -- some made by the folks who treat the Dallas Mavericks basketball players -- but they offer only partial relief. High-tension taping is the only thing that really helps me.

Again, your time and comments are greatly appreciated.

Re: taping question

john h on 1/04/03 at 15:25 (104840)

brian you could have easily signed your post John because seem to be on that road less traveled.

Re: taping question

IanJ on 1/04/03 at 21:44 (104866)

I have bilateral PF in the arches and I noticed a bit of this too although currently my right has healed a bit and seems on the road to recovery. We'll see but I suspect when one is hurting and the other isn't you favour the good/recovering one which puts more stress on it.

Re: taping question

Carole C in NOLA on 1/05/03 at 14:42 (104897)

John, can you tell yet whether or not your most recent ESWT that you had done over the holidays is going to work? I am keeping my fingers crossed hoping that it will at least help. I think a lot of us here are sending good thoughts and/or prayers your way these days. Surely after all your efforts and treatments, it's time for Lady Luck to give you a break for once.

I guess from what I've read that sometimes it takes weeks before you can tell, but sometimes it can work more quickly (especially since you are resting your feet and not climbing on the roof for a few weeks).

Carole C

Re: taping question

john h on 1/06/03 at 08:32 (104941)

Carole: It has been about 10 days since my Dornier treatment on the right foot. It is certainly no worse and my pain has varied from 1.5 to 3.5 so I consider the jury out for at least three months. I still wear othotics and either very good shoes or Airizona sandals. Generally speaking no pain unless I am on my feet. It is manageable and I work each and every day.I take no NASIDS and ride a bike and maybe walk a mile for exercise. Strangely I find to much rest almost counter productive.

Re: taping question

john h on 1/06/03 at 08:37 (104943)

Carole: It has been about 10 days since my Dornier treatment on the right foot. It is certainly no worse and my pain has varied from 1.5 to 3.5 so I consider the jury out for at least three months. I still wear othotics and either very good shoes or Airizona sandals. Generally speaking no pain unless I am on my feet. It is manageable and I work each and every day.I take no NASIDS and ride a bike and maybe walk a mile for exercise. Strangely I find to much rest almost counter productive.

Re: taping question

Carole C in NOLA on 1/06/03 at 11:13 (104955)

John, I'm glad that at least it is not worse. Guess we will know more in a few weeks or months.

Carole

Re: taping question

Barb on 1/02/03 at 14:54 (104605)

What is Leuko tape? Where do you buy it?

Re: taping question

dave r on 1/02/03 at 15:43 (104609)

Brian, i have been taping my feet for 4 years. Its the only thing that has helped me. It at least gives me the ability to walk a little more. I tape around the balls of my feet first. this helps the tape to stick better. have you ever tried a spray adhesive? that really helps to. if i know i will be doing alot of walking i will tape around my arches to help hold the tape to. I buy tape by the case. 24 rolls at a time. How is your foot feeling since you had your surgery?

Re: taping question

Pauline on 1/02/03 at 15:49 (104610)

Brian,
I found relief from using probably the cheapest sports tape around. The others you mentioned always pulled the skin off my feet. The cheap one stuck, gave me the support that I require and came off without hurting my skin.

I purchased it from Target in one of their pharmacy isles where the Dr. Scholls products are kept. The one I used is their own brand, it's an
1 1/2 ' wide and costs about $1.59 I think.

As I said, this cheap stuff worked great for me. I found the trick was to dry my feet very well after my shower, use Dr. Reynolds cream in the middle of my arch where the pain was and then apply the tape according to Scott's X taping method. I used 2 longer pieces to form the X beginning at the ball of my foot and wrapping it around the back of my heel. I'd apply it without flexing my foot toward my ankle and pull it tight but comfortable. I'd then rub my hand up and down my foot to make sure it's attached well, then I added 3 more strips across the arch area to support it.

From trial an error I learned that somedays I needed to apply more tape strips across my arch and on most days 3 would do it. I put my socks on immediately over the tape being careful not to make it roll up. Roll your sock down to the toe, stretch it as wide as you can and gently put your toes in and roll the sock up your foot making sure the tape stays in place. Then put your foot down flat on the floor putting pressure on the tape to help it remain in place. Put your shoes on and go.

On some days for extra support I actually did a second taping on top of the sock. When you need extra support you might try this. It's more difficult to remove the tape from your sock than your foot, but don't just tape the outside of your sock leaving your foot un taped. It will not supply enough support because your sock will slip.

My success story with taping. If you try it your only investing a small amount because the tape is so cheap.

Hope it helps you as it did me. If weight plays a factor in using this cheap tape it may not work for men.

Re: taping question

john h on 1/02/03 at 17:13 (104614)

Brian: I am no taping expert but Julie and I both found when we taped to tight or ran the tape up the back of the heel it would cause the achilles tendon to act up. I followed the advice I have seen several places and that is to dorsiflex the foot when taping so that when the tape is on and you relax your foot there is enough give that the tape is not pulling. I use the simple two strip method where I run one strip from the base of the great toe to just over the back of the heel. I run the other strip from just below the little toe to just over the back of the heel. i use 1 1/2' leuko tape. It is simple and can be easily done. Of course this may not work for you but do be wary of taping real tight especially if the foot is not dorsiflexed when you apply it.

Re: taping question

john h on 1/02/03 at 17:14 (104615)

I order it Barb from a medical supply house as I cannot find it in the drugstores. i think the web page is http://www.gnc.com

If that does not get you there let me know and I will give you there phone number.

Re: taping question

Leon S. on 1/02/03 at 17:56 (104618)

John, I agree with your technique. Based on your suggestion, I started taping about a week ago.I'm using regular athletic tape and the difference is remarkable. Against everyone's advice, I did go skiing on Sunday and I did not have any negative aftereffects. With the taping, I find that I am able to wear certain sneakers and shoes that I haven't been able to use in months without any appreciable pain.

Re: taping question

IanJ on 1/02/03 at 19:44 (104648)

I use the exact same strategy. Over-tightning does NOT work for me.

Re: taping question

BrianJ on 1/03/03 at 09:28 (104687)

dave r -- in answer to your question, my surgery has not produced any noticeable benefit as of yet. The 'surgical' heel still has slightly more pain than it did before surgery.

Re: taping question

dave r on 1/03/03 at 10:32 (104696)

Whats your next step going to be?
Are you planning to give it a year to see what happens?

Re: taping question

BrianJ on 1/03/03 at 12:55 (104711)

I'm not sure what my next step will be. I certainly will not get further surgery unless something really changes, as neither EPF nor Baxter Surgery has helped thus far. Actually, I'm thinking of experimenting with something that will give the benefits of taping but be more effective and more convenient. I don't want to get into it right now, as it's only an idea, and will require a lot of experimentation and refinement. You know, the Wright brothers were not the smartest and most formally trained guys, but they were creative and tenacious. Maybe that's what it will take to beat PF.

Re: taping question

dave r on 1/03/03 at 15:46 (104729)

Great idea, i will buy one if it works..
Do you think that some of the medial fibers where missed when you had your epf?

Re: taping question

BrianJ on 1/03/03 at 21:06 (104756)

Dave --

I don't think it was just missed fibers. My pain in both feet has progressed to cover all of the area just in front of the heel bone (medial, central and lateral). It's pretty much the same in both feet -- the sugical foot AND the nonsurgical foot. I think chronic strain probably resulted in the tissue becoming thick, tough and inflamed. I'm not sure much can be done to fix this (or at least manage it effectively), but I'm sure going to try.

By the way, don't let me scare you away from having surgery. At some point, when you've had this problem as long as we have, and you've tried all conservative treatments, it's reasonable to give surgery a try.

Re: taping question

Ed Davis, DPM on 1/03/03 at 22:49 (104761)

Brian:

Are you using a pre- tape spray? That will increase tape adhesion, decrease skin irritation and keep the tape in place.

The manner in which the tape is applied can be more important than tightness. Some of the minimalistic techniques work for some but the gold standard for taping of plantar fasciitis is the low dye taping.
Step 1: coat your foot with pre- tape spray - available at most sporting goods stores.
Step 2: apply the heel lock
This involves running a one inch strip around the circumference of your foot starting just behind the big toe joint, going around the back of the heel bone and ending just behind the 5th toe joint.

Your foot should be hanging down in a relaxed postion so that the arch is raised as you apply the taping.

Step3:
Take 2 inch strips and run them transversely across your foot starting with the heel, going forward to the level of the toe joints -- pull the tape gently from lateral to medial to invert the foot. Overlap the strips by about half their width. The ends of the transverse strips should end up on the heel lock portion.

Step 4: optional but helpful
Use 3 inch Elastoplast (available at many pharmacies) which is an elastic tape and run it around the forefoot area, just behind the toe joints -- that will help keep the tape in place.

Step 5:
Repeat steps 1 through 3 and finish with a heel lock strip to 'seal' the ends of the transverse strips.

Step 6:
Rub paraffin or candle wax over the whole thing several times -- this keeps the tape from catching your sock and partially waterproofs the taping -- lasts a lot longer.

Ed

Re: taping question

Ed Davis, DPM on 1/03/03 at 22:52 (104762)

John:

The strip that goes around the back of the heel needs to go right over the heel bone -- achilles irritation means that that strip was placed a bit too high on the heel.
Ed

Re: taping question

Ed Davis, DPM on 1/03/03 at 22:56 (104763)

Brian:
I have not followed your case across the boards. have you tried/considered ESWT?

Are you getting a good degree of relief from taping? We tape for two reasons: 1) to provide relief and 2) as a test to see if relief of plantar fascial tension is effective -- a pre-test to determine the effectiveness of orthotics.
Ed

Re: taping question

nancy s. on 1/03/03 at 23:24 (104764)

ed, thanks for this, especially for #6. i could not come up with a solution to the problem of the tape sticking to my socks. i'm very glad to have one.

nancy
.

Re: taping question

john h on 1/04/03 at 09:12 (104789)

Brian you have mentioned one of the great mysteries about PF that have always puzzeled me. I have bilateral PF. Surgery on one foot and multiple eswt on both feet. When one foot hurts the other foots hurts equally. If one feels better the other feels better. There is no good explanation for this. I did have one Podiatrist who was giving me a shot say to me 'I will only give you a shot in one foot because frequently when I give a shot in one foot for some reason the other foot is better also'. He said he did not know the reason but had just discovered that over many years of treating PF. Common sense says that one foot should at least be somewhat more or less painful than the other.

Re: taping question

john h on 1/04/03 at 09:16 (104790)

I agree with you DR Ed. Through experience of taping to high on the heel I quickly discovered that you can create an achilles proble. I tape it much as you descbribe. I also use a tape spray remover because if you leave the residue on you sure can irritate your feet. My tape never has a problem staying on as I dorsiflex the foot when putting it on. Getting it off is the trick. Careful here because if you rip that baby off in a hurry you can take some skin and I am here to tell you that is painful for some days and is slow healing.

Re: taping question

BrianJ on 1/04/03 at 10:46 (104809)

Dr. Ed --

Thanks very much for your valuable pointers on taping. Yes, I have tried ESWT multiple times -- two OssaTron treatments here in Dallas and also a series of three low energy treatments at the Bayshore Clinic in Toronto. They did not help me. Of course, I have also had blood tests, MRIs, X-rays and a bone scan to rule out others problems. I then had the 'Baxter Surgery' in Houston about three months ago, and have had no relief thus far. Over the years, I have had many pairs of custom orthotics -- some made by the folks who treat the Dallas Mavericks basketball players -- but they offer only partial relief. High-tension taping is the only thing that really helps me.

Again, your time and comments are greatly appreciated.

Re: taping question

john h on 1/04/03 at 15:25 (104840)

brian you could have easily signed your post John because seem to be on that road less traveled.

Re: taping question

IanJ on 1/04/03 at 21:44 (104866)

I have bilateral PF in the arches and I noticed a bit of this too although currently my right has healed a bit and seems on the road to recovery. We'll see but I suspect when one is hurting and the other isn't you favour the good/recovering one which puts more stress on it.

Re: taping question

Carole C in NOLA on 1/05/03 at 14:42 (104897)

John, can you tell yet whether or not your most recent ESWT that you had done over the holidays is going to work? I am keeping my fingers crossed hoping that it will at least help. I think a lot of us here are sending good thoughts and/or prayers your way these days. Surely after all your efforts and treatments, it's time for Lady Luck to give you a break for once.

I guess from what I've read that sometimes it takes weeks before you can tell, but sometimes it can work more quickly (especially since you are resting your feet and not climbing on the roof for a few weeks).

Carole C

Re: taping question

john h on 1/06/03 at 08:32 (104941)

Carole: It has been about 10 days since my Dornier treatment on the right foot. It is certainly no worse and my pain has varied from 1.5 to 3.5 so I consider the jury out for at least three months. I still wear othotics and either very good shoes or Airizona sandals. Generally speaking no pain unless I am on my feet. It is manageable and I work each and every day.I take no NASIDS and ride a bike and maybe walk a mile for exercise. Strangely I find to much rest almost counter productive.

Re: taping question

john h on 1/06/03 at 08:37 (104943)

Carole: It has been about 10 days since my Dornier treatment on the right foot. It is certainly no worse and my pain has varied from 1.5 to 3.5 so I consider the jury out for at least three months. I still wear othotics and either very good shoes or Airizona sandals. Generally speaking no pain unless I am on my feet. It is manageable and I work each and every day.I take no NASIDS and ride a bike and maybe walk a mile for exercise. Strangely I find to much rest almost counter productive.

Re: taping question

Carole C in NOLA on 1/06/03 at 11:13 (104955)

John, I'm glad that at least it is not worse. Guess we will know more in a few weeks or months.

Carole