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To Nancy S

Posted by Kathy G on 1/18/03 at 11:10 (105799)

Nancy,

As the dental coward of all times, I am so sorry to hear about your painful root canal! My husband has had a few and they have improved their tecniques so much over what they used to be, but it is still not a pleasant experience. There was some talk about doing a root canal on one of my teeth a couple of years ago, and I just told them to pull it out! That didn't go over big with the dentists and it never actually became an issue because they capped the tooth and it seemed to do the trick but man, I can't tell you how much I fear root canals. I hope you feel better soon and your pain lessens.

Cold enough today for you? -6.9 this morning and up to 6 now. This is definitely a winter for the books!

Re: To Nancy S

nancy s. on 1/18/03 at 19:36 (105847)

well hello there, kathy! it's 1 degree here in old orchard beach. it's going to be below zero for most of the nights this coming week. the daytimes aren't going to be great either: tuesday is scheduled to reach a high of 10 degrees. wow! a whole 10 degrees!

today a couple who spend their nonwork lives combing the beach for beach glass (and have quite a collection) came into my shop. they had just been walking the beach, and they said the waves, as they got thin and approached the shore, were freezing and turning to ice on the sand. they were amazed; they've been out there collecting for years and had never seen that before.

you were so lucky to be spared a root canal by a crowning that worked! i was tempted to tell my dentist to forget it, go ahead and put the permanent crown on, and i'll just wait till the tooth dies for the pain to go away at about age 82 (around the time i expect to give birth to my first child, if you've kept up with this tale on another thread). but this time it was obviously going to be a mistake to do that -- the pain has been very bad, and what a mess to have a root canal after the final crown is on.

i try not to be a wimp about these things, and apparently lots of people have perfectly painless root canals these days, but a painless root canal was not my destiny. during the second hour, although the tooth was still very numbed and there was no searing-type pain, there was an odd broad pain at a strange, never-before-visited-by-me level. it seemed to be filling my entire head. i kept trying to tell myself it wasn't there; at the same time, i had to hold my own hands to keep from attacking the endodontist and pummeling him with all my might.

the darvocet is working very well now. i don't feel much -- in the tooth, or anywhere else. in fact -- To Carole -- i was on my feet in the shop today way over my usual tolerance, and i don't feel a thing! maybe it is helping my feet! do you suppose anyone prescribes darvocet permanently?

stay warm, kathy. all you folks down south who occasionally complain about how cold it is at 50 degrees down there these days . . . well . . . i will keep my petty, jealous thoughts to myself!

nancy
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Re: To Nancy S

Carole C in NOLA on 1/18/03 at 19:53 (105849)

LOL, Nancy! You don't want to stay stoned on Darvocet forever. But, I'm glad that it is helping your feet. (grin)

Carole C (freezing because my struggling heater only has it up to 62 in here)

Re: To Nancy S

nancy s. on 1/18/03 at 20:07 (105852)

now carole, who says i don't want to stay stoned on darvocet forever? i know it's the WRONG thing to say if i do, but right now that's the truth, i do. it's nice to have no pain, anywhere!

awwwwwwwwww, it's only 62 in there? you'd better get out your long underwear, your great-grandmother's muff, and your big matches to light a fire in every room -- in the wastebaskets, if you have to.

and if the temp stays that bitter, i'll send you my matterhorn boots.

nancy
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Re: To Nancy S

pala on 1/18/03 at 20:16 (105854)

what would ozzy do?

Re: Nancy

wendyn on 1/18/03 at 20:17 (105855)

Nancy - right now we are at around 33F - tomorrow should be about 44. BUT, by the end of the week we should be down to 0 F and well below (our first real blast of winter this year).

We have had so little snow - one of the ski hills in the foothills has cancelled its entire season (it never opened at all). The others are open, but really struggling.

Sorry to hear about your tooth, I've never had a root canal - and I've heard enough stories to keep me flossing religously.

I haven't been around much the last couple weeks, and I've been unable to keep up on all the events on the board (even with the backwards reading).

I'm taking a night school class, as well as an on-line course (which takes up most of the computer time I used to have.

I also went on a herbal d-tox program 9 days ago (it's a 12 day program). I've never done one before, but some friends at work were doing it - and it seemed like a good time to give it a shot. You have to take an assortment of herbal supplements twice a day, and follow a fairly restricted diet for the duration.

It's been somewhat easier than I thought - but I was VERY tired for the first week. By the time I got home I just wanted to crawl into bed and sleep forever, it seemed like way too much work to try to even catch up on the board.

The diet has (hopefully) helped me break some habits. There's no dairy products or sugar allowed, so I have my one cup of decaf coffee black. I used to dump a fairly substantial amount of cream in - maybe I'll learn to live without it. There's no alcohol of any kind allowed, so I've given up the red-wine with dinner (surprising how little I missed it after a day or two).

It's a relatively healthy diet program (much easier than fasting) - all the fish, brown rice, vegetables, and almonds that you want. You can also have up to 20% of your diet from things like whole grains (no flour), chicken, eggs, pork, beef. Fruit is okay - but no tropical fruit (I do miss my bananas).

I'm looking forward to being finished on Tuesday, and I'm glad that my energy level has returned to normal. I actually feel better than I usually do. I'm going to stay off dairy for another month or so (will get my calcium other ways). I've long suspected dairy may be an issue for me - and this will be the best way to find out for sure. In the last week my usual stuffy nose has cleared up, and my skin is clearer than it has been in a long time.

I've also lost 4 pounds, I'd like to lose 1 more and then stick to this weight. 5 pounds really isn't a big deal, but I sure feel better at this weight (and everything fits better too!)

Hubby had a fit 2 weeks ago - he got on the scale and realized that he'd gained 12 pounds in the 8 weeks since he broke his arm (he needed to lose about 15 pounds to begin with). He's been following a similar diet to what I've been on (minus the herbs), and he's lost 9 pounds already. He's so proud of himself (he was showing me that he actually got to tighten his belt a notch today).

Anyway - thought I'd check in and hopefully I'll be around more often!

(ps. - Julie - nice to hear your feet are doing well and that you had a good trip!)

Re: To Nancy S

Carole C in NOLA on 1/18/03 at 20:23 (105856)

Well being stoned on Darvocet is fun NOW, but after some time passes you might get bored being stoned all the time.

I do agree that no pain is definitely the preferable condition to be in. I also agree that the pain of an abscessed tooth is WAY worse than childbirth or any other pain I've had. So for now, I'm glad the Darvocet is helping so much!!

I'm telling you, I'm really roughing it down here. I have on my blue jeans and sweatshirt, and socks with my Birkenstock Fuldas right now as I type, and my fingers are so cold I have to blow on them. I had to wear my winter coat and hat outside to cut back the banana trees earlier today. Last night I ran the water all night like a fool, but it only got down to 34 instead of the predicted 25. :)

Carole C

Re: Nancy

Carole C in NOLA on 1/18/03 at 20:31 (105858)

Now you are inspiring me to maybe get busy and lose those excess pounds that I gained during my move and over Christmas. I have gained about 20 pounds back I think and this has got to stop. I like fish a lot, though, and vegetables and brown rice as well. That actually sounds tempting, and it's healthy too.

Carole C

Re: Ozzy?

Tammie on 1/18/03 at 20:41 (105860)

when I read this , I did nto really know if you are talking about that funny show called the osborns or something my kids watch. But if so I have to say I feel a little like him the way he walks my kids say there is mom he walks like mom almost.

I do admit I watch it with them , my mouth hanging open and saying my Gosh there are other families as crazy as our own. It brought a few good laughs for me and I find if I am sad I look for it and nestle down in warmth and laugh myself to sleep! Oops I dont take his kind of meds but i do have my own ( they are perscribed tho)Hahah.

I had to reply cause I wondered if this is who you are talking about. If not I am sorry for barging in but if you not seen them they do give some laughs along with a mouth hanging open saying does this REALLY exsist?

I hope I dont give any bad impressions here by metioning this MTV sorta guy. Have a good evening and hopfully a warmer one then ours!

Re: To Nancy S

nancy s. on 1/18/03 at 20:45 (105861)

ok, being serious now, i would not want to be on darvocet all the time. i'm not even what i would call stoned. it's a pretty mild painkiller, i think? i'm just out of pain for the moment, so that alone can make a person high. my attention span is short, but that's about the only true change in personality i notice.

wait a minute, carole, why were you running your water last night? do you folks in new orleans have no heat in your homes? this never even occurred to me before.

what i really want to know, carole, having read your post about your adventure cutting back the banana trees, is: you used an X-ACTO knife for all that? didn't that take about two weeks? who is advising you down there -- andrew wyeth? for the next go-round, whenever that may be, i would send away for some kind of davy crockett knife for that job if i were you. i forget where he was from -- kentucky? isn't that where suzanne lives? maybe she can advise you.

i know it's rough, but try to stay warm down south there, we'd miss you here on the board.

nancy
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Re: To Nancy S

nancy s. on 1/18/03 at 20:47 (105863)

oh paula, i don't know about this.
i don't know what ozzy would do.

isn't he the guy who bit heads off live bats?
i know bats are related to rats, but still . . .
i do not like thats!

nancy
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Re: Nancy

nancy s. on 1/18/03 at 21:05 (105868)

hey wendy, i was wondering where you've been. so you'll finally be getting some of this Weather. i don't wish it on you, but i know you're tough and can take it.

flossing won't prevent a root canal, actually. if you weren't born with fairly soft teeth that needed fillings as a child growing up in the 1950s, you're probably safe. and in the 1950s, you weren't even an idea yet, right?

sounds like that diet was good for you (and husband). it has some things in common with the yeast-killing diet i did for a long time, and some not. i think seriously of going back to eating that way -- it did a lot of good -- but then someone always turns up here with a cheese danish or some dish with rice in it, and so on. it has to be a cold- turkey, no-exceptions decision. you did well, and i congratulate you. i remember i was able to start the yeast-killing diet because alan k said 'you can do it for at least a week and see. anyone can do anything for a week!' it lasted for nearly two years.

if you find that you feel better without dairy than with it, do you think you'll stay away from it forever?

good to see you around again, wendy. a night school class plus an online course plus work must make it about impossible to keep up with good old heelspurs.com. i took two editing jobs, to start any day now and last until MAY, because i thought my shop would stay slow as it was after christmas. of course, now it's picking up and i'll be crying over my editing desk for the next three months. so i probably won't be able to blab on and on here myself for a while -- though i'll read -- i'll always read -- i think i'm a lifer.

take care,
nancy
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Re: Nancy

wendyn on 1/18/03 at 22:19 (105871)

Carole, if you want - I can send you the link to a website that has some info on the d-tox.

I am amazed that my husband has quite the junk food and pop cold turkey. He has never been a big fan of eating properly, or of paying attention to what he eats.

My dad was read the riot act by his doctor, and he's now on an official diet too. He's really put on a lot of weight around the middle (he's about 5'9 and about 200 pounds), he's also developed high cholesterol (runs in the family) and high blood pressure. He is asking for big trouble if he doesn't drop the weight.

Carole, this is my first real experience with any type of diet - and it's been quite a lesson in discipline and self control. When I was grocery shopping today, I had to remind myself (constantly) that I was doing myself a favor - not a punishment when I walked by the cheese, and chips, and chocolate. Fortunately, my eating habits were not too bad (comparitively speaking) to begin with - but I'm still hoping this will lead to some new good habits (like eating fish more often) and breaking a few bad ones.

Re: Nancy

wendyn on 1/18/03 at 22:30 (105872)

Oh well - flossing is good for my gums anyway. While I may not have been around in the 50's I unfortunately grew up in the 70's with soft teeth that needed fillings. Here's hoping that I'm not destined for a bunch of root canals in the future!

I've been reminding myself every day that this is only 12 days. I'm still amazed at how good I feel today. I'd heard that it can make you feel run down in the first part, and some people get flu-like symptoms. I was just tired, and I had lousy concentration.

I had already given up milk and ice cream years ago (I'm not great with lactose) - so I am quite happy with soy milk on my cereal or in things like chai tea. I LOVE cheese though, and things like sour cream, and cream in my coffee.

I don't have _terrible_ skin to begin with, but it's always been super sensitive and I'm still prone to break-outs (even at my age). How nice that I get to worry about wrinkles and pimples at the same time.

Strangely enough - the 'irritated' look to my skin, and most of the blemishes have disappeared over the last 9 days....it looks like I've been taking tetracycline. This is an unexpected but welcome bonus. I also tend to get really stuffed up, especially in the mornings - but this is strangely better as well. Theoretically - I suppose it could be from 'flushing out the toxins' - but my more rational side suspects that it's from something that's been eliminated from my diet.

I picked up some calcium supplements today, and I'll stay off dairy completely for another month or so. Then - I'll go back on and watch to see if there's any change. I'd sure miss pizza.

This diet is a lot like the no-yeast (there's a lot of info on that diet it in the book I got with the kit). The d-tox doesn't allow yeast of any kind (so no bread, mushrooms, grapes, peanuts, black tea etc). Can't even use boullion in soup.

You stayed on that diet 2 years!? I'm so impressed!!!

Re: To Nancy S

Carole C in NOLA on 1/18/03 at 22:36 (105873)

We have heat in our homes. I have central gas heat and it's in the attic. What we don't have are basements, which I speculate might help to keep your pipes warm.

Anyway, houses here with raised foundations have the pipes completely exposed. Houses on a slab foundation, like mine, can have the pipes freeze where they come into the house. My pipes are completely exposed outside of the house there at the front corner behind a strategically placed bush, where the water shut-off is located.

On TV, what they tell us to do is to either cover the pipes with insulation (and Home Depot was jammed with people buying it yesterday), or we can run the water. It really doesn't get that cold here, or for very long, so it seems to me that running the water is probably sufficient. What I couldn't remember was whether to run the hot, or the cold, or both, so I ran both.

Oh, about the exacto-knife... I had gravity to help me! All I really had to do was to cut an inch deep all around, and then tip and pull the tree. That brought it down, and then I finished severing the trunk. It's not woody, or anything, but more like the world's most giant stalk of celery. A Davy Crockett knife or a saw or machete might be the implement of choice next time.

I'm lots warmer now that my heater has decided that's permissible. After I shut it off for a few minutes, I turned it back on and all is nice and toasty (for now). I'm still going to wear my socks to bed!

Carole C

Re: Nancy

Carole C in NOLA on 1/18/03 at 22:42 (105874)

I'd really like that link, Wendy! I don't know if I'd do it completely perfectly but at this point, anything that gets me eating fish and vegetables and the like again would be a change in the right direction.

Losing weight is the hardest thing for me. But I do know that I can do it, if I can just get started.

Carole C

Re: Ozzy?

pala on 1/18/03 at 22:45 (105875)

yup ozzy osbourne. i loved last season's show. this season is weak so far. i am 56 and didn't even know who he was til the mtv show! but he has a great sense of humor and is very gentle and loving to his family. i like him. or what's left of him after all the substance abuse. unfortunately it looks to me like he's working on some sort of neurological disorder. on the other hand i understand his fans are amazed he is alive or sort of alive or whatever he is at this point. why feel the need to apologize for discussing the osbournes tammy? the family is terrific entertainment. i say enjoy them guilt free. my physical therapist who is a fundamentalist christian republican bought me ozzy trading cards when i achieved a pt goal.

Re: To Nancy S

nancy s. on 1/18/03 at 22:58 (105876)

ok, i get it now about the pipes/heat and the banana trees. i've had no experience with banana trees, though i love bananas.

i think you can just run dripping cold water. people do that up here if they're going away during the winter and are afraid the power might go off and therefore their heat. you're really better off without a basement -- trouble breeds down there; it's a given, i don't know why!

glad you're toasty now.

nancy
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Re: To Nancy S

Carole C in NOLA on 1/18/03 at 23:13 (105877)

I don't know why trouble would breed in a basement. Maybe bugs, and bats, and spiders, and snakes, but trouble? LOL I think a basement would be great to have for storage space, but oh well. The reason we have no basements here is the same reason why we bury the dead in above-ground tombs: If you dig a hole in the ground here, it fills with water because we are below sea level. So, a basement would quickly become an indoor pool I guess.

A lot of the houses here, especially the older houses but a good proportion of the new ones too, are built on raised foundations. I've never had one, but they are especially practical in flood prone areas like New Orleans. People say they are awful, though. Apparently animals get under the houses, chew wires, die and stink, and so on. And then, you have to get under there get the stinky dead animals out, and later wrap the pipes if it gets cold. No fun. Slab foundations are much better except during flooding.

Carole C

Re: Nancy

nancy s. on 1/18/03 at 23:13 (105878)

i hope you can avoid them, too, wendy. maybe you grew up with more fluoride in your water than we did and that'll help. or they'll have laser treatments by the time your teeth start to fall apart! i keep thinking if i can just wait it out, anything and everything will be treatable via laser soon. the delusions of a nonscientist.

i love cheese too, it's one of my favorite foods. after three months or so i was 'allowed' to let some back into my 'diet,' and that was great. yes, two years, i was amazed myself. i threw myself right into it, and really, before long, it didn't feel like any kind of 'diet' at all. it was just how i ate, and i was never hungry and felt extra healthy, so the choices were no-brainers. i also lost the 30 pounds i'd needed to lose after almost a year of inactivity due to pf. that was a welcome side effect to the low-carb part of a yeast-killing diet, and it happened within two months or three months.

now it's been about a year since i let myself drift off it. about half of those pounds have come back, and i no longer feel the other side benefits -- similar to ones you mention -- that made the whole endeavor downright exciting.

you are tempting me greatly to return!

lol, wrinkles and pimples at the same time. from your pics, i'd say you're going to do just fine, with them or without them.

nancy
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Re: To Nancy S

wendyn on 1/18/03 at 23:14 (105879)

Carole - I don't have your email address...can you reply to this message with your email in the post (it's still hidden)....or post it here if you want.

I don't think I have your email anyway - but I will look again.

Re: To Nancy S

Carole C in NOLA on 1/18/03 at 23:15 (105880)

OK, it's in the reply but if this doesn't work, I can post it with spaces in the address like the other Nancy suggested a while back.

Carole C

Re: To Nancy S

nancy s. on 1/18/03 at 23:45 (105881)

carole, believe me, trouble does breed in basements. it's a whole life-form unto itself, and it multiplies like crazy. it meanders around and attacks your furnace, your water heater, and any other appliances you keep down there, such as the washer & dryer. it also allows a whole forest of wildlife to come forth and breed right along with it.

our last basement had mice, neuts, salamanders, little snakes, spiders, frogs, froglets, you name it. i don't mind most of those things. but it also had some horrible giant bugs i saw AND HAD TO TOUCH when we waded almost bare-naked through three-foot water during hurricane bob in 1991 to keep hoisting our appliances up higher and higher on cinderblocks. (no power, and the sump pump stopped working.) we had been homeowners for only three months at the time; we were really thrilled that we'd given up renting, you can imagine!

now we have a basement that will, without question, flood with ocean water the next time maine gets a major major storm. we are on back-dune land; it's lower than sea level, like you are. this area has flooded many times throughout the centuries; photos of it looking like the sea itself always make the front page news (last time was 1994). but it's actually a better situation than the other (inland) house, because the floor of our current basement is sand. the water will eventually soak back down into the sand, no sump pump needed, no need to call the fire dept to pump us out like in the other house (and they had to do it more than once a power outage!). right now we can dig a tiny hole down about 10 inches in our cellar and hit ocean water! it's kind of weird, but most of the time i feel stable. the house has been here 100 years.

most basements are damp some way or other. they're not that great for storage; things eventually get mildewy or moldy or rusty.

i wish someone would tell me to go to bed. but you're probably all sleeping, unless julie is just getting up! sleep well -- i'll just tell myself and do it.

nancy
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Re: To Nancy S

Julie on 1/19/03 at 03:39 (105891)

I wasn't quite up when you posted that, Nancy, but I am now. Good morning. But I hope you're asleep by now.

Re: To Nancy S

Carole C in NOLA on 1/19/03 at 07:42 (105892)

How awful! I can tell that if I lived in your former house I'd probably cave in and get a generator to keep the sump pump working, if nothing else. It never occurred to me that something like that could happen in basements. The sand basement sounds very strange because even though water would soak into the sand, I'd expect that during a storm it might get pretty high. So I'd probably put my washer and dryer upstairs! LOL

I hadn't thought about the dampness, but you're right - - I wouldn't want to store things down in a basement either.

Yes, I was asleep when you wrote your last one. Go to bed! LOL

Carole C

Re: To Nancy S

marie e on 1/19/03 at 08:18 (105896)

It's a wapping 10 degrees this morning in NE Indiana. It was one degrees yesterday. All the folks that got out yesterday to protest the possibility of war with Iraq...were brave souls. There were approximately 250 protesters in Ft. Wayne. Do any of you know how many in your cities?

marie

Re: To Nancy S

nancy s. on 1/19/03 at 08:27 (105898)

good morning, julie and carole,

i forgot to say last night that we do have the washer & dryer upstairs in this house. but the water heater and furnace are in the cellar. you're right that the water gets high before seeping back down into the sand. i don't know how the furnace has survived storms like that, but it's 20 years old. maybe if you take the motor out, that saves it.

probably the water heater drowns and has to be replaced. they're so much fun to replace! they only weigh 468,743 pounds!

time to return to bed. wasn't this fascinating? :}

nancy
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Re: To Nancy S

nancy s. on 1/19/03 at 08:46 (105901)

marie, how come you have the same weather in indiana that we have in maine? i never knew that. eleven busloads of people went from portland to dc on friday night and returned about 4 a.m. this morning. my husband was one of them. more people wanted to go, but the supply of buses ran out, so other folks took the greyhound or carpooled.
nancy
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Re: To Nancy S

wendyn on 1/19/03 at 08:48 (105902)

A sand basement? Our basements are entire living areas. Mine is fully finished with a fireplace. How do people live without basements?

(It's NEVER damp where I live)

Re: To Nancy S

Kathy G on 1/19/03 at 09:03 (105904)

Carole,

When my family moved from a city suburb in MA to a very small country town in CT, my mother was amazed when a friend called her to tell her to run the
cold water all night long during our first major freeze. Then she told her to fill the bathtub up with water, too, and my mother was totally confused. When her friend explained that if the pipes froze, we could use the water in the tub to flush the toilet, my mother decided it was time to move back to the city!

She toughed it out and actually, in the eight years we lived there, I think the pipes only froze three or four times, and she came to consider it standard operating procedure. And when my father changed jobs and we came to live in a city in NH, she was devastated because the city girl found out that she was much more suited to living in the country!

Nancy, about basements, the first house we rented in CT was the oldest house in the town. It was beautiful to look at but had absolutely no insulation in the walls. I do not exaggerate; the walls were the original wide wooden boards and my dad could hold a match up to the wall and it would flicker from the wind outside. When it was windy, the match would actually go out! And the dirt basement had ditches dug along the walls and the water in them would freeze. I thought it was nifty; I could ice skate down cellar but for some reason, my folks didn't want me down there! I was only nine years old; I thought it was neat that there was water in the cellar. After all, it was only in those ditches! We moved after one winter but I have very fond memories of that house. Needless to say, my parents didn't!

I've seen the waves do that at the beach and I think it is so neat. Of course, as my family says, the ocean could turn orange with purple foam and I'd still think it was beautiful!

BTW, it's -5 here this morning but luckily, Carole, I don't have to run the water. It's a good thing - our water bill is very high.

Keep warm, all!

Re: To Nancy S

pala on 1/19/03 at 09:10 (105905)

we have a crawl space that i and my whimp partner are afraid to go under. last time he tried a rat stood his ground against him. quaking cowardly old hippies eventually end up huddled in one last room of the house i suppose. every once in a while larry opens the crawl space door and barks into it under some theory he has developed that this will disconcert the rats. the other day our very snobby perfect house lawn car neighbor happened to walk out her door as larry was pounding on the wall yelling woof wooof woof into the crawl space. she already runs to her car with face averted from us lunatics. this should help.

Re: To Nancy S

Kathy G on 1/19/03 at 09:16 (105906)

All this talk about flooded basements brings back the memory of the first night in our house. We moved in on October 1st in a record-breaking rain storm. My husband worked all day and I supervised the movers, etc. I was exhausted. Around 11PM, he went down cellar for something and discovered that water was pouring (and I mean, pouring) into the basement through a hole in the foundation. Well, we'd always rented and had no idea what to do but we moved the boxes that were still unpacked upstairs and then proceeded to clean up the water the best we could. He used a dustpan and I don't even remember what I was using and we poured the water into a plastic pail that the previous occupant had left behind. After a short time, he said that we seemed to be making very little headway. He picked up the bucket and realized that there was a hole in it! DUH! At the time, we were both too tired to think it was very funny but now, we think it was hilarious!

He filled the hole in with hydraulic cement and put gutters on the house and now, we occasionally get a little water in that area of the basement but nothing like that first night!

Re: The Protests

Kathy G on 1/19/03 at 09:53 (105911)

Nancy,

My hats off to Phil! It was so cold! I know it's a very controversial subject but I have been so upset by the lack of protestors! I should have realized that, when you said you were going to be alone this weekend, that Phil was going. Or maybe you did say that and I missed it?

During the Vietnam War, the college campuses were a bevy of activity but now, since the draft is no longer in affect, the kids don't seem to be that involved. Not that I think they should bring back the draft, but I just get very impatient with these apathetic college kids! If our young people don't question the government, who will? My daughter goes to UNH and she says she hasn't seen much of anything there.

I won't get into controversy the on these boards, because it's not a proper forum, but I just want to say, 'Good for you, Phil!'

Marie, in the small, conservative town I live in, it would be considered a crime to say anything critical of our current adminstration. We 'closet' liberals keep our opinions to ourselves. If two people from our town went, I'd be surprised. Heck, if two hundred people from the state of NH went, I'd be surprised!

Re: The Protests

pala on 1/19/03 at 10:42 (105918)

ah so phil went. good for him. i respect him for that. it was good to see there are still war protesters. ask phil if there were lots of young people there. since the media feeds us pap and idiocy i see no young people with a social concnience. gotta be some somewhere. i did read that two hundred thousand showed up. not that they'd mention that on cnn or let us hear anyghing much that the demonstraters might say. they learned their lesson in vietnam to give this almost no real coverage. controversial shmontroversial. peolple should be free to say their opinions it bothers me here that the people on this board that i like the best are always apologizing and cringing whenever they say anything interesting or anything i agree with. if anyone attacks anyone for their opinion just tell them that suppressing freedom of expression is the opposite of what america stands for. . how on earth is menopause, war protests or ozzy osbourne too controversial to mention here. ? attacking folks is not allowed here. opinions are fine (in my opinion). :)

Re: Nancy

john h on 1/19/03 at 15:13 (105947)

Wendy: If you need another 4 lbs I will be glad to fedex it to you.

Re: The Protests

nancy s. on 1/19/03 at 17:36 (105956)

yah, phil is on his third nap for the day. he has been to the dc mall area in the past (long ago past) for demonstrations before (as have i) and says the media and all sorts of people know from experience almost exactly how many people show up for these things, just by looking out there and figuring out how much land space is taken up by bodies. he guesses at least 200,000 for the rally, and says there were far more than 30,000 on the march (that was the police estimate, the only estimate any of the media picked up on and printed, i noticed).

he says the crowds were a total mix of ages. not as many young people as he expected (yet!), but lots and lots of people in their 30s and 40s who brought their children with them, lots of aging hippies who believe what they've always believed, lots of aging people who now believe what they didn't used to believe, and a surprising number of older and even elderly folks, some of whom came from very far away to attend. everyone was peaceful, and the signs were very creative! many good talks. 'peace action maine' will be sponsoring regular demonstrations back home up here. we'll be there.

gee paula, i hope i didn't say that ozzy osbourne shouldn't be mentioned here! i don't even know the guy, but if i did, i think anyone who wants to talk about him should talk about him. even if he did bite the heads off live bats, which i'm not sure he did! if anyone did do it i wouldn't like it and said so, but that doesn't mean i think the person is off-limits for discussion. i know you're not afraid to say whatever you think, and i admire it (and, as you know, often laugh because of it). your neighbors are probably talking about you right now as i type! i'd like to be a fly on their wall.

nancy
.

Re: The Protests

pala on 1/19/03 at 17:49 (105959)

i don't think you didn't want me to talk about ozzzy. i think someone apologized or thought maybe they could not bring him up here and i was just saying that we are in sad shape if we have suppressed free expression to the point that we are apologizing for saying interesting, relavent or thoughtful things. you are one of the folks who make posting funny stuff worth it here. he did accidentally bite the head off a bat mistaking it for the stuffed animals thrown onstage that he regularly bit the head off. he had to get painful rabies shots and has said that anyone who thinks it was cool is an idiot.. he passed out when he realized it was real. if you ever watch the show you will see that mistaken confusion is the most lucid he ever gets.

Re: The Protests

pala on 1/19/03 at 18:17 (105967)

p.s. i meant in my first post to free up expression. not to criticize anyone. least of all you nancy who are one of the most kind and supportive people ever. with a great sense of humor and politics i agree with. which is getting rarer and rarer these days.

Re: The Protests

nancy s. on 1/19/03 at 20:45 (105985)

that's ok, thank you, paula -- i didn't take it as criticism, just wanted to make sure you weren't feeling silenced! (not that a person would succeed at that, right?) and i appreciate being brought up to date on the true ozzy -- because of course the aftermath of the bat event never appeared in the newspaper. now with no tv i will need you to update me periodically on ozzy's confusion, especially if it helps my clarity. thanks in advance.
nancy
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Re: John

wendyn on 1/19/03 at 22:21 (105997)

Thanks John - I know that you always have my best interests at heart. No worries though - I do not need the 4 pounds!!!

Re: The Protests - Paula

Kathy G on 1/20/03 at 09:14 (106015)

I was the one who said I didn't thin that these boards were a proper forum for politics but that's wasn't an attempt to stifle anyone who wanted to discuss them, Paula. I'm sorry if you took it to mean that. You, Nancy and I are on the same wavelength on this issue.

If you peruse my postings, you'll see that I'm a liberal Democrat from NH, a rare and unusual breed. Actually, truly liberal Democrats from anywhere are rare and unusual nowadays! To understand my true proclivities, keep in mind that I worked on George McGovern's campaign! We made history! Only one state in the union voted for him! That was the first presidential campaign I was old enough to vote in. Let's see, since that time, I've voted for a few winners but usually they were Republicans. I even voted for Gerald Ford when he lost! The way it works is that people who want to align themselves with a winner call me and ask me my opinions on a subject and who I'm going to vote for. Then they go the opposite way and they're on the winning side 9 times out of 10!

Re: The Protests - Paula

pala on 1/20/03 at 17:43 (106066)

yeah mcgovern here too. i don't think i read your post about politics not a good idea/ what i was reacting to was the apologizing and cringing of folks who say interesting great things. it makes me sad to see it here. if folks attack anyone for an opinion it is the attacker who needs to apologize. not the opiion speaker. anyway i just wanted to say that i think we should say anything here we want on any subject in of course a decent tone. and if someone comes back with a rotten tone then i for one will say that rotten tones are not appreciated here. a social board in my opinion is a good place to discuss ideas. i don't even know how to talk if i'm not talking ideas. unless i'm making really corny jokes. those who can't handle ideas that differ from theirs well that is not my problem and i hate to see anyone here making it theirs. your not so rare.. there's lots of us liberal democrats. unless a bunch were carted off the the gulag since last time i looked.

Re: To Nancy S

nancy s. on 1/18/03 at 19:36 (105847)

well hello there, kathy! it's 1 degree here in old orchard beach. it's going to be below zero for most of the nights this coming week. the daytimes aren't going to be great either: tuesday is scheduled to reach a high of 10 degrees. wow! a whole 10 degrees!

today a couple who spend their nonwork lives combing the beach for beach glass (and have quite a collection) came into my shop. they had just been walking the beach, and they said the waves, as they got thin and approached the shore, were freezing and turning to ice on the sand. they were amazed; they've been out there collecting for years and had never seen that before.

you were so lucky to be spared a root canal by a crowning that worked! i was tempted to tell my dentist to forget it, go ahead and put the permanent crown on, and i'll just wait till the tooth dies for the pain to go away at about age 82 (around the time i expect to give birth to my first child, if you've kept up with this tale on another thread). but this time it was obviously going to be a mistake to do that -- the pain has been very bad, and what a mess to have a root canal after the final crown is on.

i try not to be a wimp about these things, and apparently lots of people have perfectly painless root canals these days, but a painless root canal was not my destiny. during the second hour, although the tooth was still very numbed and there was no searing-type pain, there was an odd broad pain at a strange, never-before-visited-by-me level. it seemed to be filling my entire head. i kept trying to tell myself it wasn't there; at the same time, i had to hold my own hands to keep from attacking the endodontist and pummeling him with all my might.

the darvocet is working very well now. i don't feel much -- in the tooth, or anywhere else. in fact -- To Carole -- i was on my feet in the shop today way over my usual tolerance, and i don't feel a thing! maybe it is helping my feet! do you suppose anyone prescribes darvocet permanently?

stay warm, kathy. all you folks down south who occasionally complain about how cold it is at 50 degrees down there these days . . . well . . . i will keep my petty, jealous thoughts to myself!

nancy
.

Re: To Nancy S

Carole C in NOLA on 1/18/03 at 19:53 (105849)

LOL, Nancy! You don't want to stay stoned on Darvocet forever. But, I'm glad that it is helping your feet. (grin)

Carole C (freezing because my struggling heater only has it up to 62 in here)

Re: To Nancy S

nancy s. on 1/18/03 at 20:07 (105852)

now carole, who says i don't want to stay stoned on darvocet forever? i know it's the WRONG thing to say if i do, but right now that's the truth, i do. it's nice to have no pain, anywhere!

awwwwwwwwww, it's only 62 in there? you'd better get out your long underwear, your great-grandmother's muff, and your big matches to light a fire in every room -- in the wastebaskets, if you have to.

and if the temp stays that bitter, i'll send you my matterhorn boots.

nancy
.

Re: To Nancy S

pala on 1/18/03 at 20:16 (105854)

what would ozzy do?

Re: Nancy

wendyn on 1/18/03 at 20:17 (105855)

Nancy - right now we are at around 33F - tomorrow should be about 44. BUT, by the end of the week we should be down to 0 F and well below (our first real blast of winter this year).

We have had so little snow - one of the ski hills in the foothills has cancelled its entire season (it never opened at all). The others are open, but really struggling.

Sorry to hear about your tooth, I've never had a root canal - and I've heard enough stories to keep me flossing religously.

I haven't been around much the last couple weeks, and I've been unable to keep up on all the events on the board (even with the backwards reading).

I'm taking a night school class, as well as an on-line course (which takes up most of the computer time I used to have.

I also went on a herbal d-tox program 9 days ago (it's a 12 day program). I've never done one before, but some friends at work were doing it - and it seemed like a good time to give it a shot. You have to take an assortment of herbal supplements twice a day, and follow a fairly restricted diet for the duration.

It's been somewhat easier than I thought - but I was VERY tired for the first week. By the time I got home I just wanted to crawl into bed and sleep forever, it seemed like way too much work to try to even catch up on the board.

The diet has (hopefully) helped me break some habits. There's no dairy products or sugar allowed, so I have my one cup of decaf coffee black. I used to dump a fairly substantial amount of cream in - maybe I'll learn to live without it. There's no alcohol of any kind allowed, so I've given up the red-wine with dinner (surprising how little I missed it after a day or two).

It's a relatively healthy diet program (much easier than fasting) - all the fish, brown rice, vegetables, and almonds that you want. You can also have up to 20% of your diet from things like whole grains (no flour), chicken, eggs, pork, beef. Fruit is okay - but no tropical fruit (I do miss my bananas).

I'm looking forward to being finished on Tuesday, and I'm glad that my energy level has returned to normal. I actually feel better than I usually do. I'm going to stay off dairy for another month or so (will get my calcium other ways). I've long suspected dairy may be an issue for me - and this will be the best way to find out for sure. In the last week my usual stuffy nose has cleared up, and my skin is clearer than it has been in a long time.

I've also lost 4 pounds, I'd like to lose 1 more and then stick to this weight. 5 pounds really isn't a big deal, but I sure feel better at this weight (and everything fits better too!)

Hubby had a fit 2 weeks ago - he got on the scale and realized that he'd gained 12 pounds in the 8 weeks since he broke his arm (he needed to lose about 15 pounds to begin with). He's been following a similar diet to what I've been on (minus the herbs), and he's lost 9 pounds already. He's so proud of himself (he was showing me that he actually got to tighten his belt a notch today).

Anyway - thought I'd check in and hopefully I'll be around more often!

(ps. - Julie - nice to hear your feet are doing well and that you had a good trip!)

Re: To Nancy S

Carole C in NOLA on 1/18/03 at 20:23 (105856)

Well being stoned on Darvocet is fun NOW, but after some time passes you might get bored being stoned all the time.

I do agree that no pain is definitely the preferable condition to be in. I also agree that the pain of an abscessed tooth is WAY worse than childbirth or any other pain I've had. So for now, I'm glad the Darvocet is helping so much!!

I'm telling you, I'm really roughing it down here. I have on my blue jeans and sweatshirt, and socks with my Birkenstock Fuldas right now as I type, and my fingers are so cold I have to blow on them. I had to wear my winter coat and hat outside to cut back the banana trees earlier today. Last night I ran the water all night like a fool, but it only got down to 34 instead of the predicted 25. :)

Carole C

Re: Nancy

Carole C in NOLA on 1/18/03 at 20:31 (105858)

Now you are inspiring me to maybe get busy and lose those excess pounds that I gained during my move and over Christmas. I have gained about 20 pounds back I think and this has got to stop. I like fish a lot, though, and vegetables and brown rice as well. That actually sounds tempting, and it's healthy too.

Carole C

Re: Ozzy?

Tammie on 1/18/03 at 20:41 (105860)

when I read this , I did nto really know if you are talking about that funny show called the osborns or something my kids watch. But if so I have to say I feel a little like him the way he walks my kids say there is mom he walks like mom almost.

I do admit I watch it with them , my mouth hanging open and saying my Gosh there are other families as crazy as our own. It brought a few good laughs for me and I find if I am sad I look for it and nestle down in warmth and laugh myself to sleep! Oops I dont take his kind of meds but i do have my own ( they are perscribed tho)Hahah.

I had to reply cause I wondered if this is who you are talking about. If not I am sorry for barging in but if you not seen them they do give some laughs along with a mouth hanging open saying does this REALLY exsist?

I hope I dont give any bad impressions here by metioning this MTV sorta guy. Have a good evening and hopfully a warmer one then ours!

Re: To Nancy S

nancy s. on 1/18/03 at 20:45 (105861)

ok, being serious now, i would not want to be on darvocet all the time. i'm not even what i would call stoned. it's a pretty mild painkiller, i think? i'm just out of pain for the moment, so that alone can make a person high. my attention span is short, but that's about the only true change in personality i notice.

wait a minute, carole, why were you running your water last night? do you folks in new orleans have no heat in your homes? this never even occurred to me before.

what i really want to know, carole, having read your post about your adventure cutting back the banana trees, is: you used an X-ACTO knife for all that? didn't that take about two weeks? who is advising you down there -- andrew wyeth? for the next go-round, whenever that may be, i would send away for some kind of davy crockett knife for that job if i were you. i forget where he was from -- kentucky? isn't that where suzanne lives? maybe she can advise you.

i know it's rough, but try to stay warm down south there, we'd miss you here on the board.

nancy
.

Re: To Nancy S

nancy s. on 1/18/03 at 20:47 (105863)

oh paula, i don't know about this.
i don't know what ozzy would do.

isn't he the guy who bit heads off live bats?
i know bats are related to rats, but still . . .
i do not like thats!

nancy
.

Re: Nancy

nancy s. on 1/18/03 at 21:05 (105868)

hey wendy, i was wondering where you've been. so you'll finally be getting some of this Weather. i don't wish it on you, but i know you're tough and can take it.

flossing won't prevent a root canal, actually. if you weren't born with fairly soft teeth that needed fillings as a child growing up in the 1950s, you're probably safe. and in the 1950s, you weren't even an idea yet, right?

sounds like that diet was good for you (and husband). it has some things in common with the yeast-killing diet i did for a long time, and some not. i think seriously of going back to eating that way -- it did a lot of good -- but then someone always turns up here with a cheese danish or some dish with rice in it, and so on. it has to be a cold- turkey, no-exceptions decision. you did well, and i congratulate you. i remember i was able to start the yeast-killing diet because alan k said 'you can do it for at least a week and see. anyone can do anything for a week!' it lasted for nearly two years.

if you find that you feel better without dairy than with it, do you think you'll stay away from it forever?

good to see you around again, wendy. a night school class plus an online course plus work must make it about impossible to keep up with good old heelspurs.com. i took two editing jobs, to start any day now and last until MAY, because i thought my shop would stay slow as it was after christmas. of course, now it's picking up and i'll be crying over my editing desk for the next three months. so i probably won't be able to blab on and on here myself for a while -- though i'll read -- i'll always read -- i think i'm a lifer.

take care,
nancy
.

Re: Nancy

wendyn on 1/18/03 at 22:19 (105871)

Carole, if you want - I can send you the link to a website that has some info on the d-tox.

I am amazed that my husband has quite the junk food and pop cold turkey. He has never been a big fan of eating properly, or of paying attention to what he eats.

My dad was read the riot act by his doctor, and he's now on an official diet too. He's really put on a lot of weight around the middle (he's about 5'9 and about 200 pounds), he's also developed high cholesterol (runs in the family) and high blood pressure. He is asking for big trouble if he doesn't drop the weight.

Carole, this is my first real experience with any type of diet - and it's been quite a lesson in discipline and self control. When I was grocery shopping today, I had to remind myself (constantly) that I was doing myself a favor - not a punishment when I walked by the cheese, and chips, and chocolate. Fortunately, my eating habits were not too bad (comparitively speaking) to begin with - but I'm still hoping this will lead to some new good habits (like eating fish more often) and breaking a few bad ones.

Re: Nancy

wendyn on 1/18/03 at 22:30 (105872)

Oh well - flossing is good for my gums anyway. While I may not have been around in the 50's I unfortunately grew up in the 70's with soft teeth that needed fillings. Here's hoping that I'm not destined for a bunch of root canals in the future!

I've been reminding myself every day that this is only 12 days. I'm still amazed at how good I feel today. I'd heard that it can make you feel run down in the first part, and some people get flu-like symptoms. I was just tired, and I had lousy concentration.

I had already given up milk and ice cream years ago (I'm not great with lactose) - so I am quite happy with soy milk on my cereal or in things like chai tea. I LOVE cheese though, and things like sour cream, and cream in my coffee.

I don't have _terrible_ skin to begin with, but it's always been super sensitive and I'm still prone to break-outs (even at my age). How nice that I get to worry about wrinkles and pimples at the same time.

Strangely enough - the 'irritated' look to my skin, and most of the blemishes have disappeared over the last 9 days....it looks like I've been taking tetracycline. This is an unexpected but welcome bonus. I also tend to get really stuffed up, especially in the mornings - but this is strangely better as well. Theoretically - I suppose it could be from 'flushing out the toxins' - but my more rational side suspects that it's from something that's been eliminated from my diet.

I picked up some calcium supplements today, and I'll stay off dairy completely for another month or so. Then - I'll go back on and watch to see if there's any change. I'd sure miss pizza.

This diet is a lot like the no-yeast (there's a lot of info on that diet it in the book I got with the kit). The d-tox doesn't allow yeast of any kind (so no bread, mushrooms, grapes, peanuts, black tea etc). Can't even use boullion in soup.

You stayed on that diet 2 years!? I'm so impressed!!!

Re: To Nancy S

Carole C in NOLA on 1/18/03 at 22:36 (105873)

We have heat in our homes. I have central gas heat and it's in the attic. What we don't have are basements, which I speculate might help to keep your pipes warm.

Anyway, houses here with raised foundations have the pipes completely exposed. Houses on a slab foundation, like mine, can have the pipes freeze where they come into the house. My pipes are completely exposed outside of the house there at the front corner behind a strategically placed bush, where the water shut-off is located.

On TV, what they tell us to do is to either cover the pipes with insulation (and Home Depot was jammed with people buying it yesterday), or we can run the water. It really doesn't get that cold here, or for very long, so it seems to me that running the water is probably sufficient. What I couldn't remember was whether to run the hot, or the cold, or both, so I ran both.

Oh, about the exacto-knife... I had gravity to help me! All I really had to do was to cut an inch deep all around, and then tip and pull the tree. That brought it down, and then I finished severing the trunk. It's not woody, or anything, but more like the world's most giant stalk of celery. A Davy Crockett knife or a saw or machete might be the implement of choice next time.

I'm lots warmer now that my heater has decided that's permissible. After I shut it off for a few minutes, I turned it back on and all is nice and toasty (for now). I'm still going to wear my socks to bed!

Carole C

Re: Nancy

Carole C in NOLA on 1/18/03 at 22:42 (105874)

I'd really like that link, Wendy! I don't know if I'd do it completely perfectly but at this point, anything that gets me eating fish and vegetables and the like again would be a change in the right direction.

Losing weight is the hardest thing for me. But I do know that I can do it, if I can just get started.

Carole C

Re: Ozzy?

pala on 1/18/03 at 22:45 (105875)

yup ozzy osbourne. i loved last season's show. this season is weak so far. i am 56 and didn't even know who he was til the mtv show! but he has a great sense of humor and is very gentle and loving to his family. i like him. or what's left of him after all the substance abuse. unfortunately it looks to me like he's working on some sort of neurological disorder. on the other hand i understand his fans are amazed he is alive or sort of alive or whatever he is at this point. why feel the need to apologize for discussing the osbournes tammy? the family is terrific entertainment. i say enjoy them guilt free. my physical therapist who is a fundamentalist christian republican bought me ozzy trading cards when i achieved a pt goal.

Re: To Nancy S

nancy s. on 1/18/03 at 22:58 (105876)

ok, i get it now about the pipes/heat and the banana trees. i've had no experience with banana trees, though i love bananas.

i think you can just run dripping cold water. people do that up here if they're going away during the winter and are afraid the power might go off and therefore their heat. you're really better off without a basement -- trouble breeds down there; it's a given, i don't know why!

glad you're toasty now.

nancy
.

Re: To Nancy S

Carole C in NOLA on 1/18/03 at 23:13 (105877)

I don't know why trouble would breed in a basement. Maybe bugs, and bats, and spiders, and snakes, but trouble? LOL I think a basement would be great to have for storage space, but oh well. The reason we have no basements here is the same reason why we bury the dead in above-ground tombs: If you dig a hole in the ground here, it fills with water because we are below sea level. So, a basement would quickly become an indoor pool I guess.

A lot of the houses here, especially the older houses but a good proportion of the new ones too, are built on raised foundations. I've never had one, but they are especially practical in flood prone areas like New Orleans. People say they are awful, though. Apparently animals get under the houses, chew wires, die and stink, and so on. And then, you have to get under there get the stinky dead animals out, and later wrap the pipes if it gets cold. No fun. Slab foundations are much better except during flooding.

Carole C

Re: Nancy

nancy s. on 1/18/03 at 23:13 (105878)

i hope you can avoid them, too, wendy. maybe you grew up with more fluoride in your water than we did and that'll help. or they'll have laser treatments by the time your teeth start to fall apart! i keep thinking if i can just wait it out, anything and everything will be treatable via laser soon. the delusions of a nonscientist.

i love cheese too, it's one of my favorite foods. after three months or so i was 'allowed' to let some back into my 'diet,' and that was great. yes, two years, i was amazed myself. i threw myself right into it, and really, before long, it didn't feel like any kind of 'diet' at all. it was just how i ate, and i was never hungry and felt extra healthy, so the choices were no-brainers. i also lost the 30 pounds i'd needed to lose after almost a year of inactivity due to pf. that was a welcome side effect to the low-carb part of a yeast-killing diet, and it happened within two months or three months.

now it's been about a year since i let myself drift off it. about half of those pounds have come back, and i no longer feel the other side benefits -- similar to ones you mention -- that made the whole endeavor downright exciting.

you are tempting me greatly to return!

lol, wrinkles and pimples at the same time. from your pics, i'd say you're going to do just fine, with them or without them.

nancy
.

Re: To Nancy S

wendyn on 1/18/03 at 23:14 (105879)

Carole - I don't have your email address...can you reply to this message with your email in the post (it's still hidden)....or post it here if you want.

I don't think I have your email anyway - but I will look again.

Re: To Nancy S

Carole C in NOLA on 1/18/03 at 23:15 (105880)

OK, it's in the reply but if this doesn't work, I can post it with spaces in the address like the other Nancy suggested a while back.

Carole C

Re: To Nancy S

nancy s. on 1/18/03 at 23:45 (105881)

carole, believe me, trouble does breed in basements. it's a whole life-form unto itself, and it multiplies like crazy. it meanders around and attacks your furnace, your water heater, and any other appliances you keep down there, such as the washer & dryer. it also allows a whole forest of wildlife to come forth and breed right along with it.

our last basement had mice, neuts, salamanders, little snakes, spiders, frogs, froglets, you name it. i don't mind most of those things. but it also had some horrible giant bugs i saw AND HAD TO TOUCH when we waded almost bare-naked through three-foot water during hurricane bob in 1991 to keep hoisting our appliances up higher and higher on cinderblocks. (no power, and the sump pump stopped working.) we had been homeowners for only three months at the time; we were really thrilled that we'd given up renting, you can imagine!

now we have a basement that will, without question, flood with ocean water the next time maine gets a major major storm. we are on back-dune land; it's lower than sea level, like you are. this area has flooded many times throughout the centuries; photos of it looking like the sea itself always make the front page news (last time was 1994). but it's actually a better situation than the other (inland) house, because the floor of our current basement is sand. the water will eventually soak back down into the sand, no sump pump needed, no need to call the fire dept to pump us out like in the other house (and they had to do it more than once a power outage!). right now we can dig a tiny hole down about 10 inches in our cellar and hit ocean water! it's kind of weird, but most of the time i feel stable. the house has been here 100 years.

most basements are damp some way or other. they're not that great for storage; things eventually get mildewy or moldy or rusty.

i wish someone would tell me to go to bed. but you're probably all sleeping, unless julie is just getting up! sleep well -- i'll just tell myself and do it.

nancy
.

Re: To Nancy S

Julie on 1/19/03 at 03:39 (105891)

I wasn't quite up when you posted that, Nancy, but I am now. Good morning. But I hope you're asleep by now.

Re: To Nancy S

Carole C in NOLA on 1/19/03 at 07:42 (105892)

How awful! I can tell that if I lived in your former house I'd probably cave in and get a generator to keep the sump pump working, if nothing else. It never occurred to me that something like that could happen in basements. The sand basement sounds very strange because even though water would soak into the sand, I'd expect that during a storm it might get pretty high. So I'd probably put my washer and dryer upstairs! LOL

I hadn't thought about the dampness, but you're right - - I wouldn't want to store things down in a basement either.

Yes, I was asleep when you wrote your last one. Go to bed! LOL

Carole C

Re: To Nancy S

marie e on 1/19/03 at 08:18 (105896)

It's a wapping 10 degrees this morning in NE Indiana. It was one degrees yesterday. All the folks that got out yesterday to protest the possibility of war with Iraq...were brave souls. There were approximately 250 protesters in Ft. Wayne. Do any of you know how many in your cities?

marie

Re: To Nancy S

nancy s. on 1/19/03 at 08:27 (105898)

good morning, julie and carole,

i forgot to say last night that we do have the washer & dryer upstairs in this house. but the water heater and furnace are in the cellar. you're right that the water gets high before seeping back down into the sand. i don't know how the furnace has survived storms like that, but it's 20 years old. maybe if you take the motor out, that saves it.

probably the water heater drowns and has to be replaced. they're so much fun to replace! they only weigh 468,743 pounds!

time to return to bed. wasn't this fascinating? :}

nancy
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Re: To Nancy S

nancy s. on 1/19/03 at 08:46 (105901)

marie, how come you have the same weather in indiana that we have in maine? i never knew that. eleven busloads of people went from portland to dc on friday night and returned about 4 a.m. this morning. my husband was one of them. more people wanted to go, but the supply of buses ran out, so other folks took the greyhound or carpooled.
nancy
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Re: To Nancy S

wendyn on 1/19/03 at 08:48 (105902)

A sand basement? Our basements are entire living areas. Mine is fully finished with a fireplace. How do people live without basements?

(It's NEVER damp where I live)

Re: To Nancy S

Kathy G on 1/19/03 at 09:03 (105904)

Carole,

When my family moved from a city suburb in MA to a very small country town in CT, my mother was amazed when a friend called her to tell her to run the
cold water all night long during our first major freeze. Then she told her to fill the bathtub up with water, too, and my mother was totally confused. When her friend explained that if the pipes froze, we could use the water in the tub to flush the toilet, my mother decided it was time to move back to the city!

She toughed it out and actually, in the eight years we lived there, I think the pipes only froze three or four times, and she came to consider it standard operating procedure. And when my father changed jobs and we came to live in a city in NH, she was devastated because the city girl found out that she was much more suited to living in the country!

Nancy, about basements, the first house we rented in CT was the oldest house in the town. It was beautiful to look at but had absolutely no insulation in the walls. I do not exaggerate; the walls were the original wide wooden boards and my dad could hold a match up to the wall and it would flicker from the wind outside. When it was windy, the match would actually go out! And the dirt basement had ditches dug along the walls and the water in them would freeze. I thought it was nifty; I could ice skate down cellar but for some reason, my folks didn't want me down there! I was only nine years old; I thought it was neat that there was water in the cellar. After all, it was only in those ditches! We moved after one winter but I have very fond memories of that house. Needless to say, my parents didn't!

I've seen the waves do that at the beach and I think it is so neat. Of course, as my family says, the ocean could turn orange with purple foam and I'd still think it was beautiful!

BTW, it's -5 here this morning but luckily, Carole, I don't have to run the water. It's a good thing - our water bill is very high.

Keep warm, all!

Re: To Nancy S

pala on 1/19/03 at 09:10 (105905)

we have a crawl space that i and my whimp partner are afraid to go under. last time he tried a rat stood his ground against him. quaking cowardly old hippies eventually end up huddled in one last room of the house i suppose. every once in a while larry opens the crawl space door and barks into it under some theory he has developed that this will disconcert the rats. the other day our very snobby perfect house lawn car neighbor happened to walk out her door as larry was pounding on the wall yelling woof wooof woof into the crawl space. she already runs to her car with face averted from us lunatics. this should help.

Re: To Nancy S

Kathy G on 1/19/03 at 09:16 (105906)

All this talk about flooded basements brings back the memory of the first night in our house. We moved in on October 1st in a record-breaking rain storm. My husband worked all day and I supervised the movers, etc. I was exhausted. Around 11PM, he went down cellar for something and discovered that water was pouring (and I mean, pouring) into the basement through a hole in the foundation. Well, we'd always rented and had no idea what to do but we moved the boxes that were still unpacked upstairs and then proceeded to clean up the water the best we could. He used a dustpan and I don't even remember what I was using and we poured the water into a plastic pail that the previous occupant had left behind. After a short time, he said that we seemed to be making very little headway. He picked up the bucket and realized that there was a hole in it! DUH! At the time, we were both too tired to think it was very funny but now, we think it was hilarious!

He filled the hole in with hydraulic cement and put gutters on the house and now, we occasionally get a little water in that area of the basement but nothing like that first night!

Re: The Protests

Kathy G on 1/19/03 at 09:53 (105911)

Nancy,

My hats off to Phil! It was so cold! I know it's a very controversial subject but I have been so upset by the lack of protestors! I should have realized that, when you said you were going to be alone this weekend, that Phil was going. Or maybe you did say that and I missed it?

During the Vietnam War, the college campuses were a bevy of activity but now, since the draft is no longer in affect, the kids don't seem to be that involved. Not that I think they should bring back the draft, but I just get very impatient with these apathetic college kids! If our young people don't question the government, who will? My daughter goes to UNH and she says she hasn't seen much of anything there.

I won't get into controversy the on these boards, because it's not a proper forum, but I just want to say, 'Good for you, Phil!'

Marie, in the small, conservative town I live in, it would be considered a crime to say anything critical of our current adminstration. We 'closet' liberals keep our opinions to ourselves. If two people from our town went, I'd be surprised. Heck, if two hundred people from the state of NH went, I'd be surprised!

Re: The Protests

pala on 1/19/03 at 10:42 (105918)

ah so phil went. good for him. i respect him for that. it was good to see there are still war protesters. ask phil if there were lots of young people there. since the media feeds us pap and idiocy i see no young people with a social concnience. gotta be some somewhere. i did read that two hundred thousand showed up. not that they'd mention that on cnn or let us hear anyghing much that the demonstraters might say. they learned their lesson in vietnam to give this almost no real coverage. controversial shmontroversial. peolple should be free to say their opinions it bothers me here that the people on this board that i like the best are always apologizing and cringing whenever they say anything interesting or anything i agree with. if anyone attacks anyone for their opinion just tell them that suppressing freedom of expression is the opposite of what america stands for. . how on earth is menopause, war protests or ozzy osbourne too controversial to mention here. ? attacking folks is not allowed here. opinions are fine (in my opinion). :)

Re: Nancy

john h on 1/19/03 at 15:13 (105947)

Wendy: If you need another 4 lbs I will be glad to fedex it to you.

Re: The Protests

nancy s. on 1/19/03 at 17:36 (105956)

yah, phil is on his third nap for the day. he has been to the dc mall area in the past (long ago past) for demonstrations before (as have i) and says the media and all sorts of people know from experience almost exactly how many people show up for these things, just by looking out there and figuring out how much land space is taken up by bodies. he guesses at least 200,000 for the rally, and says there were far more than 30,000 on the march (that was the police estimate, the only estimate any of the media picked up on and printed, i noticed).

he says the crowds were a total mix of ages. not as many young people as he expected (yet!), but lots and lots of people in their 30s and 40s who brought their children with them, lots of aging hippies who believe what they've always believed, lots of aging people who now believe what they didn't used to believe, and a surprising number of older and even elderly folks, some of whom came from very far away to attend. everyone was peaceful, and the signs were very creative! many good talks. 'peace action maine' will be sponsoring regular demonstrations back home up here. we'll be there.

gee paula, i hope i didn't say that ozzy osbourne shouldn't be mentioned here! i don't even know the guy, but if i did, i think anyone who wants to talk about him should talk about him. even if he did bite the heads off live bats, which i'm not sure he did! if anyone did do it i wouldn't like it and said so, but that doesn't mean i think the person is off-limits for discussion. i know you're not afraid to say whatever you think, and i admire it (and, as you know, often laugh because of it). your neighbors are probably talking about you right now as i type! i'd like to be a fly on their wall.

nancy
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Re: The Protests

pala on 1/19/03 at 17:49 (105959)

i don't think you didn't want me to talk about ozzzy. i think someone apologized or thought maybe they could not bring him up here and i was just saying that we are in sad shape if we have suppressed free expression to the point that we are apologizing for saying interesting, relavent or thoughtful things. you are one of the folks who make posting funny stuff worth it here. he did accidentally bite the head off a bat mistaking it for the stuffed animals thrown onstage that he regularly bit the head off. he had to get painful rabies shots and has said that anyone who thinks it was cool is an idiot.. he passed out when he realized it was real. if you ever watch the show you will see that mistaken confusion is the most lucid he ever gets.

Re: The Protests

pala on 1/19/03 at 18:17 (105967)

p.s. i meant in my first post to free up expression. not to criticize anyone. least of all you nancy who are one of the most kind and supportive people ever. with a great sense of humor and politics i agree with. which is getting rarer and rarer these days.

Re: The Protests

nancy s. on 1/19/03 at 20:45 (105985)

that's ok, thank you, paula -- i didn't take it as criticism, just wanted to make sure you weren't feeling silenced! (not that a person would succeed at that, right?) and i appreciate being brought up to date on the true ozzy -- because of course the aftermath of the bat event never appeared in the newspaper. now with no tv i will need you to update me periodically on ozzy's confusion, especially if it helps my clarity. thanks in advance.
nancy
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Re: John

wendyn on 1/19/03 at 22:21 (105997)

Thanks John - I know that you always have my best interests at heart. No worries though - I do not need the 4 pounds!!!

Re: The Protests - Paula

Kathy G on 1/20/03 at 09:14 (106015)

I was the one who said I didn't thin that these boards were a proper forum for politics but that's wasn't an attempt to stifle anyone who wanted to discuss them, Paula. I'm sorry if you took it to mean that. You, Nancy and I are on the same wavelength on this issue.

If you peruse my postings, you'll see that I'm a liberal Democrat from NH, a rare and unusual breed. Actually, truly liberal Democrats from anywhere are rare and unusual nowadays! To understand my true proclivities, keep in mind that I worked on George McGovern's campaign! We made history! Only one state in the union voted for him! That was the first presidential campaign I was old enough to vote in. Let's see, since that time, I've voted for a few winners but usually they were Republicans. I even voted for Gerald Ford when he lost! The way it works is that people who want to align themselves with a winner call me and ask me my opinions on a subject and who I'm going to vote for. Then they go the opposite way and they're on the winning side 9 times out of 10!

Re: The Protests - Paula

pala on 1/20/03 at 17:43 (106066)

yeah mcgovern here too. i don't think i read your post about politics not a good idea/ what i was reacting to was the apologizing and cringing of folks who say interesting great things. it makes me sad to see it here. if folks attack anyone for an opinion it is the attacker who needs to apologize. not the opiion speaker. anyway i just wanted to say that i think we should say anything here we want on any subject in of course a decent tone. and if someone comes back with a rotten tone then i for one will say that rotten tones are not appreciated here. a social board in my opinion is a good place to discuss ideas. i don't even know how to talk if i'm not talking ideas. unless i'm making really corny jokes. those who can't handle ideas that differ from theirs well that is not my problem and i hate to see anyone here making it theirs. your not so rare.. there's lots of us liberal democrats. unless a bunch were carted off the the gulag since last time i looked.